MAN WOMAN INTERACTION LECTURE #14 Eger, Hungary, 6th Aug 2007 Part 2

Mataji: What is the connection or… Connection between religious and spiritual?

HH BVPS Maharaja: What’s the connection?

Mataji: Or difference?

HH BVPS Maharaja: Between religious and spiritual? Religious means, it’s acting according to the inherent nature of someone, of any entity, animate or inanimate, spiritual or non-spiritual, the inherent nature that can’t be changed, that’s religion. So spiritual means, you are dealing with the eternal nature, or eternal religion, sanatana-dharma. So then that’s the perfection of religion. But at the same time is, if your purpose is spiritual realization, then we even take basically varnashrama within the realm of sanatana-dharma, because it’s being used, the principles of the religion there are the same as in the spiritual world. And they are being used for spiritual understanding. Does that make sense?

So basically when we are meaning religious, we are meaning what is the proper, what is the nature, what is the proper relationship and interaction with another entity. And then generally we are taking spiritual meaning philosophy. So in other words, the very philosophically grounded and practicing husband and religious meaning, she is following the culture of Krishna consciousness properly, then that combination works. Because the men will generally look more at the philosophy, the women will look more at the culture, because philosophy is tattva, it’s intelligence, while culture is applied intelligence, that means, the mind. So the intelligence is masculine, the mind is feminine, so therefore the masculine perspective will be grounded in the intelligence, and the feminine within the mind. Does that make sense? That’s why, let’s say, intelligence means, it discerns between things and what is common. So that means, what are the options, either by separating things or putting things together. The mind is accepting and rejecting, so the mind accepts or rejects those options. Do you understand?

So that’s why’ll you see, men sometimes can just go, “Well, we could do this, we could do that,” so many things. But it’s not very attractive to the women, because it’s devoid of any emotional content. It’s purely intellectual. But the women will generally react more with “I like this, I don’t like this.” Or they get bewildered, when they can’t figure out if they like it or not. You know what I am saying? So if it’s purely intellectual, then the woman is bewildered. “I could do this, I could do that, I could do so many things,” so that’s intelligence working, but she is not comfortable till the mind goes, “this” or “that.” Does that make sense? That’s why we were saying some time before was that therefore in the intellectual explanation of something, if you show the emotional, I mean, what will be gained emotionally, then it makes it easier for the mind to accept it or reject it. Does that make sense? Did we answer the question? Yes? Okay. How many have we done?

Translator: There is two more.

Written question: I would like to hear in more detail about what it means when in the compatibility chart the stri-dirgha isn’t there and the woman inspires the man to create the field?

HH BVPS Maharaja: When the woman inspires the man to create the field?

Written question: And if this is the case, then can the woman inspire the man to create and operate the field?

HH BVPS Maharaja: Erm, I would probably, to get more exact detail, we have to wait for someone to come back. You know, we got to know what’s that work there.

But in general then, if she is unable to inspire him to generate and broaden the field, then that means she’d need to be satisfied with less field. Means, in other words, a woman’s satisfaction of what a man has generated is, at least for a responsible man, is the greatest inspiration to expand the field. Right? Does that make sense? Means, the man has provided something, the woman is satisfied with that, then he is comfortable to try to provide more. If he provides something and then she is not satisfied, then he has a tendency with time not to be comfortable providing anything, because whatever he provides, she doesn’t like anyway, so therefore why provide? In other words, if a man is sensitive to the needs of the woman, then he can generate satisfaction in her. Right? And if she is satisfied, that generates in him the nature to be sensitive and considerate, they nourish each other. Does that make sense? So even if that’s not there, just by this then that is underlying that whole principle. These compatibility are details of sense control and sensitivity in the man and chastity and satisfaction in the woman. Does that make sense? More technical detail, you have to wait for the astrologer.

Written question: What is the proper behavior for both parties if the man has more emotional needs than what the woman can provide?

HH BVPS Maharaja: [Laughter] That’s funny. You know what I am saying, it’s funny because it didn’t say “what if the man has more emotional needs than the woman”?

Translator: That’s what it says.

HH BVPS Maharaja: No it said “if it’s the man has more emotional needs than the woman can provide.” You know what I am saying?

Translator: “What the woman provides.” It doesn’t say…

HH BVPS Maharaja: Oh, “provides.” Oh, okay. Okay, well, I mean, the point is is, he married the woman, so that’s what she can do, so – Haribol! You buy a two-seat car, don’t expect you can stick in the family and groceries. Do you understand? Means, she should do the best she can, but the man should know that when… It’s like that, there is two different kinds of emotions that they manifest. One, the woman is happy to deal with, one is she absolutely would rather not. So it may be, he is manifesting the form that women don’t appreciate. The form that they don’t mind is if due to circumstances it just emotionally caves in on the guy and he just breaks down.

Translator: That’s what they…

HH BVPS Maharaja: That’s what the women can deal with, because then by giving some attention and some support then the man is able to get it back together and push forward. With that, women are quite happy dealing with that one. So that’s not a problem. So intensity is not a problem, but it has to be that kind. Means, by the forces of nature the man just breaks down.

But the kind where the man is feeling bad and sorry for himself and feels, “I need some attention,” women want to have nothing to do with that. Because that’s generated from the mode of ignorance. You know what I am saying? So therefore it’s purely masculine, how they are supposed to deal with it? You know what I am saying? It’s in Sankarshana, because it’s just, “I am supposed to be dealt with, I need to,” so they put themselves in the center, and so how is the woman supposed to deal with it, what’s her relationship? Do you see the difference?

But the kind where the mind is there, you wanna do this, you wanna do that, but it just doesn’t work, it all falls apart, that’s in the realm of Aniruddha, so that’s purely in the feminine environment. They like dealing with that, because it’s in their field. Does that make sense? So you would have to differentiate between the two kinds of emotional need here. So if the guy feeling sorry and feels he needs all the attention, because his mommy always gave him all the attention, he was the center of everything in the house, then women couldn’t care less about that. So a good kick in the backside generally is the solution for that one. Right?

So you can generally tell which one you are in by if you break down, and then they come and give support, that’s the right one, and if you in your mind have broken down, and they just get upset or ignore you, then you know it’s the wrong one. A man gets emotional support because he deserves it, not because he wants it. “I want that Lamborghini.” So what? Who cares? Come up with the cash, then you get it Deserve it, then you get it. So unless you’ve done something to deserve it, why you’ll get it? You know what I am saying? So, Prabhupada says, “First deserve, then desire.” Does that make sense? Was that correct? Yes? Anyone else? Yeah? [Laughter] Yes? Got it? [Laughter]

Prabhu: I just got a text message question, the same question to ask.

HH BVPS Maharaja: He received the text question?

Translator: Yes. He received on his phone text message question to ask.

HH BVPS Maharaja: They are coming in from around the world? [Laughter] From the kitchen? [Laughter] Oh, the Deity room?

Prabhu: The problem is that the wife is asking what should she do, so what should I respond, is it better to say something to the wife, or better to speak with the husband?

HH BVPS Maharaja: I didn’t quite get the question.

Translator: So the wife is asking the same question…

HH BVPS Maharaja: Exact same question?

Translator: Yes, same question, like how to deal with the emotional need of the husband.

HH BVPS Maharaja: Well, the point is is the emotional need of the husband that’s the kind of women can deal with, they have no problem dealing with that. Unless, of course, it’s a woman that no one ever dealt with her, so therefore then she takes on the… How you say? The occupation of a prune.

Translator: Prune?

HH BVPS Maharaja: You know, prune, it’s a kind of dried fruit, very wrinkly and shriveled up. You don’t have that here, I don’t know… It’s like that. I don’t know. At least in American you generally compare sometimes older people to, like they are dried up and shriveled up like prunes. Then it may be hard for her to deal with any emotion, because she even can’t deal with hers, nobodies, because no one has ever dealt with her.

But if that’s not the case, then they enjoy dealing with emotions. What was that? Some saying about… How you say? I forgot what the title is, I don’t know if you have ever heard of it. Means, like an intelligent, up-to-date man that is also sensitive and can be emotional and… There is a name for it. Like that, so they don’t mind dealing with the emotions, the women. Bu they don’t wanna deal with the emotions where the man feels sorry for himself and therefore feels he should get so much attention, because that attention generally means, he does nothing, he doesn’t even have to reciprocate, he just has to feel sorry for himself and thinks unlimited energy is just going to pour in without any reciprocation back. Right? So that, there is no reciprocation, just like the man doesn’t like that the woman doesn’t reciprocate, women don’t like if the men don’t reciprocate. Right? So since woman’s nature goes back and forth, therefore if it has gone one way, it will flip back the other, therefore you can deal with the emotion. Because they will be very emotional, but it will only go one direction so far before it comes back the other way. But masculine focus just goes in a straight line. So if the man is feeling sorry for himself, it just goes into ignorance and keeps going, it doesn’t flip back, so what he is supposed… What’s the woman supposed to deal with?

You know, and even if you think about it seriously, even your mother would probably just give a pat on the head and a little something on the cheek and go, “Oh, don’t worry, it will be okay,” and then walk off. Right? Or she’d say, “Ah, don’t worry, be a man, come on!” You know, and the walk of. So it’s true, you would get that much out of your mother, but that’s it. That you are going to sit there and cry and feel bad and wife will just sit there and give a hug and “Don’t worry,” and then go on for how many hours you just really feel that you just really wanna… You know, like that. Forget it. It’s like that. Some complaint in the kitchen? Is that okay? Text messengers satisfied? What you do is they send the text messages, and you put it on, and then you put it on mic, and then you get your text message back. Or is it the call, the radio station is calling your question!

Prabhu: From what you said yesterday somehow I understood that after Radha-Krishna and transcendental activities, the man should be most attached to his wife. Does this mean that in a man’s life devotional activities, sadhana, temple programs, relationships with the devotees are considered more important, or they have a higher priority than before his wife?

HH BVPS Maharaja: [Laughter] You need some intelligence here. You have to be able to tell the difference between things. Pure spiritual is above all things, but within the material realm then the wife is comfortable if she knows she is the most important of anything on the material platform. So when you say “the Vaishnavas,” does that mean the spiritual element of serving the vaishnavas with your life and soul and everything that you have, or does that mean going over to a friend’s house and partying? You know what I am saying? So if it’s the first one, then that’s fine, she understands that, because that will be service. But if it’s just going over to hang out, she is also a devotee, and so you can’t hang out with the others at the expense of hanging out with her. So in other words, either you take her to go hang out if she is in the mood, if she is not in the mood, you won’t go to hang out. And your service in the temple, is it the service itself, meaning that devotional expression to Krishna, or is it the conditional attachment to that particular activity that you happen to be engaging in the Lord’s service? Does that make sense?

Let us just take for example, cooking. Okay. So now is it the service to the Deity of cooking that you are attached to, or it’s that you like to cook, and you are able to by the Lord’s arrangement engage it in the Lord’s service? You know what I am saying?

Prabhu: The first one, so the activities that are necessary for the temple service.

HH BVPS Maharaja: Yes, but then why does the question come up, there is no problem. The question comes up because there is a problem.

Prabhu: Yes, because…

HH BVPS Maharaja: It’s because you are not making the distinction between the two. Is it that you wanna go to the temple to serve or is it that you wanna get out of the house, and going to the temple is a great way to cover up for wanting to get out of the house. Before the guys would go fishing or go to the bar, or like this, you go to the temple. Good. Spiritual. But… You know what I am saying? What’s the motive, that’s the point. That’s why I am saying, you need intelligence, you have to be able to tell the difference. Women are smart, they are able to tell the difference.

Prabhu: The wife was complaining that you are to engage in some kind of… So you don’t pay attention to that, because you are engaged in service..

HH BVPS Maharaja: In service? But that could be… Means, here you have literally what they say and then you have what they mean. So they could be saying, “You spend too much time at the temple.” Means, that when you are not at the temple, when you are with them, they actually don’t feel that they are important, so the quality of your interaction with them isn’t satisfying. So what’s looking for is the quality, but if you don’t get the quality within the time that’s there, the natural thing is to expand the time, maybe you can find the quality. Right? So one way of getting it is expanding the amount of time that has the possibility to get the quality interaction. So that’s one.

[Microphone sound changes] Can you put it down a little bit? Hello, hello. Haribol. [Laughter] People in the kitchen… [Laughter] Haribol. Okay, that’s better.

So that would be in the negative, means, so therefore it’s one way that they are trying to get you to improve the quality of interaction. Doesn’t mean that it has to be that way, just means, in some way when you are with them that the the quality interaction is valuable. So it doesn’t change the service, means you have to pay more attention and try harder when you are not doing the service.

Or, let’s say, put it into the positive. You are doing such a great job that when you are with her, it’s so nice, she would like to have more time. So she is just saying that, “Oh, if you didn’t do the service then there could be more time together.” Like that. But that, it’s understood, you have to do your service. It’s just nice. Does that make sense? Did that work? Do you understand? Means, in other words, there is what they say and then there is what they mean. So they are expecting you to be intelligent enough to what they say, you figure out what they mean. And now and again what they say is what they mean. And whenever that happens, you have to take that seriously. Don’t joke, don’t laugh, don’t harass, don’t bring up the past, just take it. And what they say at those moments, don’t apply just to that moment, those apply to all the time. What they say that has underlying meanings, that’s what they are saying for this moment, but what they say and mean, that’s for all moments. Does that make sense?

In other words, by what we’ve been discussing when the brahmachari says, “You know, yes, I though I should be a little more responsible and kind-of like that and be more mature,” and all that, that’s what you actually have to do, it’s not just something you say to your friends, so then it makes it, smooths it over and sounds politically correct. Right? Being a grihastha means serious responsibility that you gotta use all your intelligence, all your energy to make work. Right? Okay? Yes?

Prabhu: What happens when we offend the wives and how does it affect…

HH BVPS Maharaja: Trouble. Serious trouble. We have some historical examples. One of the best ones is known as Hiroshima, and if you didn’t quite get the idea, then there is Nagasaki. [Laughter] Yeah, those are probably the two best examples. Another example would be Julius Caesar, I mean, he was…Yeah. But otherwise, Nagasaki, Hiroshima, good examples.

So, means, what can you do?

Prabhu: How to correct it?

HH BVPS Maharaja: Sustained, sincere humility and repentance. Right? You got that? Anything else? That would do it? Eh? Yeah. But sustained, means, how long it takes to correct it. Like that, so it’s not that, “Okay, I did my bit for 10 minutes and now how come she is not okay?” No. However long it takes. So in other words, how long it takes, that means you know how much she was hurt. Does that make sense? So how much anxiety or that they give you is how much they’ve got. They won’t give you more, do you understand? You belong to them, so they don’t wanna bother you more. But you must be appropriately corrected, so that means then there should be that much. They hurt that much, that means you will hurt that much. And if you take it properly, then it stops right there. If you don’t take it properly, means, then there is hurt on top of that hurt, it will keep going. Yeah? Very simple formula.

Now, one may say, why would they do that? That’s because of attachment. If the woman is not attached, she couldn’t care less, because women have to generate experience, they can’t function in an environment where there is not an experience that they want. So they are only going to interact with something that gives an experience that they wanna get. So if they are interacting with you, that’s based on attachment, they don’t interact means they are not attached. Does that make sense? So that’s how you know, if they don’t respond, don’t interact means there is no interest. You got that? So that’s the point. Okay? So, if they are interacting, that means they are attached, so therefore if you behave properly, it will work out, because they want it to work out. But it’s just they want you to take on the appropriate mentality. Right? Does that make sense?

And then one may question, but what about them? If you do this, they will automatically do that themselves with themselves, because when they explode and then you act properly, that amazes them so much that then they correct themselves. Means, anybody who would do that for them, then they feel bad and they correct themselves, and the more quickly and smoothly you do that, the more the effect on them. Sometimes they’ll tell you about it, sometimes they won’t, or let’s say, sometimes they’ll tell you, most of the time they won’t. If they really felt they are wrong, they’ll tell you but if it was one of those things that it’s wrong, but, you know… Then they won’t say anything, but you’ll see the change. Okay?

Mataji: I would like to ask about fights, in my experience in the early years we had most of the fights, because the husband was really annoyed by someone else and then came home, and then at the first word that I said he blew up. So in my experience husbands are sometimes using wife just as… What is it that keeps the lightning away, the lightning pads?

HH BVPS Maharaja: Oh, lightning pad, it’s a nice word, in America they’d say, “Punching bag.” Husband comes, he yells at the wife, the wife at the older kid, that at the younger kid, and they go and kick the dog, dog bites the postman… [Laughter]

Mataji: So I saw that the problem got solved was that the whole life situation changed, and then the husband wasn’t annoyed so much, and then the things settled.

HH BVPS Maharaja: That’s one way to do it. The other one is, when he comes home, meet him at the door with the rolling pin, and says, “You yell, I swing.” [Laughter] Or when you meet him at the door and say, “Hi, honey, if you are gonna yell, turn around and walk out right now!”

Mataji: He doesn’t want to scream, so he is trying very hard to control himself, and to be tolerant, but he doesn’t have patience…

HH BVPS Maharaja: Then in that case then when he blows up, you just know that it’s just steam. And then after he has yelled and screamed and ranted in raid, then you just ask him, “Anything else?” in a very pleasant voice and then ask him if he wants some more rice or sabji. Right? And then he’ll think, “Oh, that was stupid, why did I yell at you?” You know what I am saying? In other words, if you don’t react badly, and the same thing as we mentioned before, then he’ll feel stupid for yelling at you when it has nothing to do with you. You know what I am saying? If you know that that happens… Or you just say, “Oh, having a bad day…” And then they’ll say, “Yes, this that, sorry I yelled,” and you say, “No, no, that’s okay, just don’t do it again.” [Laughter]

Mataji: I understand that the principle of authority, the kid’s idea or determination to follow authority gets damaged when the wife screams at the husband. But why doesn’t it affect the child’s commitment to follow authority if the husband screams at the wife? Because I heard that this is something the husband can do.

HH BVPS Maharaja: No, it goes both ways. I goes both ways, means, if they have something that they disagree, do it somewhere where the kid doesn’t hear it, what does the kid have to do with it? You know what I am saying? I never heard that. And it’s possible to do. Because the point is is, disagreement doesn’t have to be at 147 dB, you know. Like that.

Prabhu: So I talked to another church, and there we were… I would like to understand how this principle applies to community life, and there we were taught that when somebody does something wrong, then the authority should correct the individual separately, not in front of the whole community of believers or devotees. So does this apply to us as well that it’s better if authorities correct individuals separately, or it’s actually good to be corrected in front of others, because that breaks our false ego and creates more humility?

HH BVPS Maharaja: Depends upon how the individual is going to handle it. Point is is, the individual has to learn. So therefore if it’s something that you could correct in that environment and they would be comfortable, then that’s all right, but if they’d be uncomfortable, then you have to correct them separately. You know what I am saying? So you have to see is you deal with somebody according to what is there. Because if you are correcting… In other words, it has to be a person that doesn’t mind being corrected, then only it can be done in front of others. But then when you are correcting them, actually you are talking about what everybody else needs to understand. Right? That’s called in Bengali correcting…”Instructing the daughter-in-law by correcting the daughter.” Does that make sense? The mother tells her own daughter, “If you do this and that then this will happen, that will happen,” all these kind-of things, but the daughter-in-law is there in the room. So that means, what you are saying is actually meant for the daughter-in-law, but it’s said in such a way that it looks like it applies to the daughter, and in may be valuable for the daughter also, but you are doing two things at once. Does that make sense? But it has to be a relationship that doesn’t mind being corrected in that environment. If they do mind, then you don’t do that, then you talk to them separately. Does that make sense?

Prabhu: From the perspective of the congregation, is it sentimental to say that such a correction shouldn’t take place that the person shouldn’t be corrected in front of others?

HH BVPS Maharaja: No, because you want them to be corrected. So if by correcting in front of others the ego gets disturbed so much that they won’t take the instruction, then that means, there is no correction, means your endeavor had no meaning. Teaching must get results, so is it just that you wanted to say it or that someone should absorb it and practice it? Right? If it’s an individual that is basically… Estranged, that’s the word? It means, they don’t relate. If you have a person that doesn’t relate to anybody, no one can get along with them, they never really learn. So therefore if you tell them privately, they won’t get any benefit, you tell them publicly, they still don’t get any benefit, but at least everybody else gets the benefit. You know what I am saying? So if someone is like that, very thick-skinned and just doesn’t get along and doesn’t really… It’s so insensitive that it doesn’t really matter to them whether it’s private or public, it won’t work anyway. So generally you would use public, if it came up publicly, then everybody else would get the benefit. But you don’t talk to them. You talk at them, but what you talk about is what’s beneficial to everybody else, it’s because it’s person that no one else gets along with, you can get into all kinds of grungy details that are too delicate to tell everybody else, but you can tell them and everybody will be happy that you said it. Right? But actually it was meant for everybody else. But since it was a third party, then you accept it very easily. That’s basically, what I have seen is the only real advantage of having a fool. [Laughter] [Indistinct 53:29]

Mataji: In the modern world we see that there is arisen, have taken very strange turn, and in some countries it’s more manifest than, for example, in Hungary. I have France in my mind, where you see many fathers with prams, you see more fathers with the prams and the babies and with those bags than mothers, and they publish even comic books about men executing the work of women, and the children, and the family life executed by the husband at home. So if the society around us is completely [indistinct 54:10] Yeah, how can we [indistinct 54:17 ] independent from their values system and how can we avoid like subconsciously following their value system and that direction?

HH BVPS Maharaja: Means, one, means, you have the detail, or the external manifestation. But underlying that will be something else. Why wouldn’t a woman wanna be with the kid? That must mean that the attachment within her hasn’t been developed very well, or hasn’t been able to be expressed. The men are too busy with their jobs, so that’s more important. So therefore the women therefore get too busy with their jobs. Right? You know what I am saying? So it’s not value that they are with the kid and take care of the kid, so the woman’s ego can’t handle that they are being put in a second-rate position. She is supposed to be respected, therefore they’re seeing it as disrespect. So the tendency will be to flip the scales. You know what I am saying? So that would be one element. So generally it just means that the emotional content is not very great. So then the only medium for generating any kind of emotional is through sensual. So therefore they will manifest their emotional needs through sensual. But somebody gets into sensual, that means, they lead the sensual, so these kind-of emotional things don’t come into place. Menaka came and had Shakuntala, but as soon as she is born, she just leaves her on the bank and leaves, because they function just in the realm of senses, it’s not emotional. You know what I am saying? It’s their way of accessing the emotions, but she was considerate, she put the child in a place where I think it was Kanva Muni would find her. So she saw that here is a rishi who’d properly take care of the girl and he always takes bath here at this time, and so therefore I will leave the child there. But as far as sentiment goes, society girls don’t have sentiment, because you lose control. You know what I am saying? So then therefore as the culture goes more towards society girls, therefore then the emotional content drops, and therefore the feminine, natural feminine manifestation also drops. Does that make sense?

But at the same time is, you also have the element that much of the time you would have more relatives. So the mother would watch for some time, then her mother and then other sister-in-law, sisters or sister-in-laws, so in this way the kids would always be taken care of. Lord Ramachandra spent more time with the co-wife than His own mother. Kaushalya was His mother, but He spent more time with Kaikeyi. Like that. Does that make sense? So you also have that element. And then you have the element that nowadays either the amount of material desire is very great or the economic generative ability is less, then you might have husband and wife has to work. Or, she is not getting any prestige out of her relationship, so she has to get it by working. You know what I am saying? So it’s not that this is a normal bonafide trend. There is something underlying that creates it. You know what I am saying?

Mataji: Yes.

HH BVPS Maharaja: So that’s more what to look at, that’s how you don’t get caught up in it. If you only look at externals, then it looks one way, but underlying it’s still the same. Does that make sense? So you have to determine what’s the reason that that’s happening. There is only the two of them, so therefore sometimes the husband watches, sometimes the wife watches. Also, sometimes depends, if it’s a boy or a girl. Generally you’ll see boys are more, interact more with the mother and daughters more with the father. So that element might be there, their economic situation might be there, or the family unit maybe a consideration. Or it maybe the husband doesn’t know how to deal with the wife, or before the husband has come along, then the father or previous husbands or other members of the family or friends have completely psychologically disturbed this girl, so she’s got issues. And the husband either doesn’t know what’s going on, so it’s just getting worse, or he does know, but it’s still gonna take time. Does that make sense? Is that okay? So it’s not that “they are doing this, so that’s a standard,” no, it’s you have to figure out why it’s there.

Mataji: I wonder whether it could be the outcome of the effect that for example in Hungary in previous centuries one of the woman’s designations or names was the “woman animal.”

HH BVPS Maharaja: The woman animal?

Mataji: Yes.

HH BVPS Maharaja: Up to 250 years ago Christianity, means, the Church, did not acknowledge that women had souls. You know what I am saying? The Vedic has always acknowledged that they had souls. [Laughter] We are way ahead of all these other guys, you know.

Mataji: And just one last thing, that what would you say would be the outcome of this whole tendency?

HH BVPS Maharaja: The outcome of this whole tendency?

Mataji: Yes, of this reversal of sexual roles, or roles in society, that men take the roles of women and vice versa?

HH BVPS Maharaja: Erm… The government paying money to anybody who is willing to have kids? Women marrying women? Men marrying men?

Mataji: Yeah, in certain countries…

HH BVPS Maharaja: Means, you see, the more that’s going on, the more these things are going on. You know what I am saying?

Mataji: Yeah, and then?

HH BVPS Maharaja: So it might work for a generation or two, but then it will stop. Somebody from a big family, likes family, then he may, okay, “If you wanna kid, you take care of it!” “Okay.” Right? No guarantee, his kids are gonna agree to that. Does that make sense?

Mataji: So it will revert to the natural order, in a cycle?

HH BVPS Maharaja: It will revert to the natural order? Well, it will revert to the natural order or to the way modes of nature designate the unnatural order. Like worms, they are both male and female, so you don’t have to worry about equal rights, who is gonna take care of the kids, nothing. You don’t have Mr. and Mrs. Worm. “I’d like you to meet Mr.&Mrs. Worm and his partner Mr.&Mrs. Worm.” You know what I am saying? So, Krishna has a way of working it out. And I read one study where they say… Before they were saying ants were the greatest numbers of living entities. But some opine that it’s worms, seeing that they just found a whole bunch of unlimited worms that live under the mud in the ocean that they didn’t know existed. No ants down there, at least they haven’t found so far, you know, ocean ants. You know what I am saying? So Krishna works it out, this is all, nothing is new, every Kali-yuga they do this. Every Kali-yuga there is a France, there is a Hungary, there is the Lower Slobbovia.

Mataji: There is a social custom of greeting people when we meet them. Despite of that social custom, my experience is that devotees have a tendency to avoid this social custom, and I have the experience that many times devotees who are in age younger than me when they meet me or we see each other in the street, they just ignore me. How to relate to this point?

HH BVPS Maharaja: How to relate? But “relate” means there is something there relatable to.

Mataji: [Laughter]

HH BVPS Maharaja: As I mentioned before, every devotee has accepted the philosophy of Krishna consciousness. Generally someone who actually has the philosophy kind-of wrong or very strange, you can count them. There is one here in this country and one over there, and everybody knows that they have their own philosophy. So philosophy devotees have accepted very well. But culture, not necessarily. You know what I am saying? So that’s the problem. So until the devotees accept the culture, then we are always going to have cultural difficulties, in other words, they threw out their previous culture, which is fine, but they are not accepting the new. And any principle in the previous that worked is actually there in the Vedic. Concept of greeting people, that’s there in the Vedic, therefore it’s in every other culture of the world. The concept of ritual for marriage, for eating, birth and education, and manhood, death, that’s there in the Vedic culture. So every other culture has it also. They may have their own unique form of it, but the concept is there. The concept that there is an intellectual or a spiritual personality is there in every culture. Political authority is there in every culture, economics is there in every culture. Like that. Those who assist is there in every culture. Justice is in every culture, morality is in every culture, sense gratification is in every culture. Right? Some sense of a way to elevate yourself is there in every culture. Some kind of supreme power is there in every culture. So all the elements of human life that are perfectly manifest in the Vedic, are there in every other culture, because that’s where it’s from. They just may have some unique way of manifesting it. And if it works, it’s generally because it’s closer to the Vedic principle, though its form may be very different. You know what I am saying? Like gravity here doesn’t act any differently than gravity somewhere else, therefore engineering is non-different than engineering anywhere else. They just may have found different ways to manifest it. But the principles of engineering are principles of engineering. Does that make sense? Like that. Is that okay?

Mataji: I would like to ask about the duties or responsibilities of the fathers in connection to the children who are different in age or in gender, because some fathers like are completely involved in bathing the kids or taking care of them, and some fathers don’t even want to look at them.

HH BVPS Maharaja: Whatever works, you know what I am saying? Because it’s just between the father and mother to work out what works for them. Some ladies like to do everything, some like to work with the other person, so it’s just what works. So if the father is not very much interested, it doesn’t matter, because that’s technically the duty of the wife. But if he likes to be involved, then fine. You know what I am saying? Like that.

Prabhu: It is connected to the previous question. When we converse to Krishna consciousness then you said that the person throws out everything from the culture he’s been following and then throughout the years then again starts picking up what was actually good from there is also emphasized here. So I think that actually this is the only way it can be done, that you throw everything out, because you cannot really at that time differentiate between what’s valuable and what’s not. Or is there another way?

HH BVPS Maharaja: Yeah, no, no. I mean, that’s okay. But the point is is that someone should be training them in what is the proper behavior and culture, it shouldn’t be that everybody has to work it out themselves, because if they don’t get educated, then there is a problem. Does that make sense? Like that. So that they throw it out, that’s not the problem, the problem is is that it’s not replaced. That someone is willing to throw it out means commitment, so that’s okay, that’s nice, but it should be replaced with something. That’s the point. Just like, okay, we are eating nonsense food, so we become a devotee, so we throw out the nonsense food, but we don’t eat any prasadam. Right? Does that make sense? So because there is prasada, you are not eating other food. But if there was no prasada, you would go back to eating what you ate before. So one is throwing out the culture, if you don’t give them new culture, they’ll go back to their old culture. You know what I am saying? Like that. Is that okay?

Prabhu: Yes.

Prabhu: So I would like to ask how to solve certain situations…

HH BVPS Maharaja: When brahmacharis and brahmacharinis meet?

Prabhu: It’s in a bus, let’s say…

HH BVPS Maharaja: Oh, in a bus…

Prabhu: So, let’s sayy, they’re both from the same town, so they know each other very well, they even come from the same town or something. They are both get on the bus, but because they are not supposed to be together, the boy sits down at the front of the bus and the girl sits down at the back of the bus, and then other people get on the bus, and the girl is surrounded by a bunch of karmi men, and the boy may be surrounded by a bunch of karmi women. That doesn’t seem to be a problem, I mean, for them, but the people may find it strange that you are a Hare Krishna and she is a Hare Krishna, so why is it that you are sitting here with a bunch of other women who are not even Hare Krishnas and she is sitting with a bunch of men there? In India it wouldn’t be a problem, because there men and women are separated naturally, but here if such a situation arise, so what could be the solution? [Laughter]

HH BVPS Maharaja: How long you’ve been thinking of this one? [Laughter]

Prabhu: It just came up in my mind.

HH BVPS Maharaja: It just came up… [Silence] Problem is, the answer takes maturity. Okay, well, one is, has anybody asked you why they are sitting separately?

Prabhu: Yes, this was before, once it happened to me.

HH BVPS Maharaja: Okay, so do you say that you are a monk?

Prabhu: Yes.

HH BVPS Maharaja: And what did they say?

Prabhu: There was a conversation, and I deflected the direction of the conversation towards something else. [Laughter]

HH BVPS Maharaja: Deflect, very good. In theory, you could say that the women should be protected, one, why would they be on the bus alone anyway, why they are not travelling with someone else? Or you could say is that they’re there then they could sit together in one principle, but, you know, they wouldn’t talk or interact. But problem is, if you are not dealing with some maturity, then the tendency will be to become attracted. Does that make sense?

The other thing is, you could do is, in the bus, the boy sits over here, the girl doesn’t have to sit at the back, just at another seat that’s close by, and so as long as everything is going smoothly then you don’t worry about it, but if a bunch of punks start to bother the girl, then the brahmachari tells them to [indistinct 01:23:08]. So that way then there is not really any interaction, but still the girls are taken care of. You know what I am saying? But it’s as long as the bus ride. You know what I am saying? When the doors of the bus open, then there is no connection. You know what I am saying? So better if the girls are travelling together, like that. They shouldn’t be travelling alone. Of course, they can always keep a good quality stun gun with them, you know, one of those little things that have 250,000 Watts, I mean, Volts? In India the girls know the different kinds of pinching. There is one that they have that if anybody gets too close and bumps into them and they pinch with that, it feels like somebody just jabbed you with a pin. Very effective, at least in India.

Prabhu: If we understand and are able to apply the… We understand how the relationship functions between the husband and wife and are able to apply it, does this mean that we can improve the other relationships and the relationships within the community, so the community can also function better?

HH BVPS Maharaja: Yes.

Prabhu: This means, we have to take this like that?

HH BVPS Maharaja: Like that. In other words, you are supposed to know these social skills anyway, but one is not so interested. Right? But, generally speaking, one is very interested that his married life goes well. So because of that attachment you are inspired to try to make the same principles that work in any relationship, work there. Does that make sense? So you may have not learned them anywhere else, because you are not attached enough to really try. Either not spiritual enough, or not attached enough. Does that make sense? So because of attachment you will pay attention and learn here. So then that means, you could apply it somewhere else. Generally you’ll find that really nice, very balanced lady in the community, elder lady, and she takes care and organizes and sees to everybody, if you see her in her house, she is the same. You know, or the older gentleman who is always concerned about all the little details and everybody in the group and all that, generally because he is doing that at his house. No?

So because of attachment you will learn it, if you are determined, you are humble, you are tolerant, all these things, you will learn. Of course, if you’re not then you won’t learn, but you don’t have any great skills anywhere else either. You know what I am saying? Anyone with good social skills is good in the home, and anyone who is good at home does have the potential to have good social skills if they connect it to. Does that make sense? Right? So the point is is, you are not listening, you have two brahmacharis in the brahmachari ashrama talk to your blue in the face about being considerate, and one brahmachari still flicks on the light in the middle of the night, because he is too unorganized to put his stuff where he can find it, so everybody else may suffer. But his thing is, “What’s the big deal? Don’t be attached Prabhu, sleeping is maya, Prabhu!” [Laughter] Like that. But so is keeping their stuff like a garbage bin. And so is waking up the other devotees, who are sleeping for Krishna. So because he won’t learn it there, no matter how much you tell him, therefore he gets to marry a girl who is gonna take off her shoe and beat the guy into submission. [Laughter] So that’s the point. The really “manly” guys get man-handled in the most demeaning way. Means, the not-so-macho guys learn from the other men. The real macho guys have to be beaten into submission by a woman. So that’s the point, wherever your attachments are, only there you learn. You know what I am saying? So that’s the Vedic system. Otherwise, the brahmana, kshatriya, vaishya, shudra, brahmachari, grihastha, vanaprastha and sannyasi, they are all learning the same thing, but depending upon their attachment they are learning the whole process through one particular door. Does that make sense?

Prabhu: So it means it’s better if we go deep into this husband-wife relationship and try to understand that, meaning us who are sitting here? Or ask other little questions, which are superficial, if we do that to get into so many other things, but it’s not deep enough than any, we are not getting anyway but if we go deeper into this than anyway all the others will be answered or so?

HH BVPS Maharaja: We are waiting for depth.

Prabhu: How will even brahmacharis learn this? I know some senior brahmacharis who have actually become very untolerable, although they have been serving for so many years, then how will they learn?

HH BVPS Maharaja: It’s the same principle, why are they intolerable, because they don’t know how to deal with anyone. So it’s the same, the same principles apply, just you apply the example, you don’t use husband and wife, you use them and another brahmachari, or them and their bed, or them and their spoon, or them and their car.

Prabhu: The grihastha is forced by the wife to learn, but the brahmachari, especially as they get older, they are the most senior, so no one is forcing them to learn. Especially if they are far away from their spiritual masters and they have a travelling sankirtana, then there is nobody who should tell them something.

HH BVPS Maharaja: But they are being maintained by somebody? That means… Brahmachari means, socially he is on the bottom of the pile, so therefore socially he can be instructed technically by any grihastha. Because he may say, “I am senior, I know more shlokas,” we are not talking shlokas. We are talking human behavior here. So therefore the grihastha is is a superior position. But the point is is, these things should be worked out when they are younger. It should always be explained, the same principles apply. It’s like this. If I describe brahmacharya, I have a class on brahmacharya, then the ones in saffron will listen, means, the men. The ones in white, generally it’s “been there, done that,” their mood is “been there, done that.” So whatever you say to them, they won’t even take on board. The women will pay attention, but the men won’t learn anything. But if we talk about grihastha life and specifically interaction between man and woman, everybody in the block is paying attention. You know what I am saying? So therefore that’s why that’s the most effective way to discuss about relationship. Not that it… It could be explained in so many different ways. You know what I am saying?

The brahmachari, okay, you go into the brahmachari ashrama. All the furniture in the brahmachari ashrama is trashed. So what does that mean? That means, they don’t understand, one, that it’s Krishna’s furniture, they think their service is more important than anything else, so they are insensitive and they are not sense controlled. So when they deal with the cabinet, when they slam the door shut, they are not taking into consideration the nature of the cabinet. You can only close the cabinet or open it in a way that’s favorable for the cabinet. Does that sound familiar from what we’ve been describing? Oh, we’ve changed this, now if I say “cabinet,” half the guys have fallen asleep. If I say “woman” – Ding! “What, what? Where?” [Laughter] Do you understand? So it’s the same principles. So if they are rough and this and that and no one can relate to them, as long as it’s consistent that they don’t even care about themselves, then they are an avadhuta. But if they care about themselves, they organize everything nicely for themselves, but everybody else it’s a disaster, then they are bachelors, they are not brahmacharis. You know what I am saying? But if you see is that they dress, they don’t care how they dress and they don’t care what they eat or what situation they are in, and therefore they don’t care what situation or what everybody else does either, then that’s an avadhuta. You know what I am saying? You know, they are a little wild, but no one really minds them, unless, of course, they are dealing in an area that’s important to you. But if other than that, then… You know what I am saying? That’s how you tell the difference. Like that. Does that make some sense? So the point is is, it’s very easy to explain exactly the same thing to the brahmacharis.

Another way of doing it is throw it back and forth in and out of the female and their environment. Means, you train every brahmachari how to remain a brahmachari, but you also discuss with them as if in the future once you are trained as a brahmachari if you wanted to get married, then this is how you would have to apply there. Means, we explained in the beginning, a grihastha is a brahmachari who did not realize the understanding to be learned from the brahmachari practice. So now he does those same practices in the grihastha ashrama and due to his attachment and the force of the women, he will learn it. If the brahmachari is not humble, he cannot remain a brahmachari. They may be wearing saffron, but they are not brahmacharis. A brahmachari is a humble, menial servant, that’s brahmachari. Like that. If he is puffed-up he is not a brahmachari, he is just unmarried. You know what I am saying? And much of the time too proud to get married, not that he wouldn’t want to. So therefore if he learns the humility there, he learns the tolerance, he is respectful to everyone else, he is not looking that he must be respected and get facility for service rendered, he can be a brahmachari the rest of his life, it’s that simple. Or, if he wants to get married and he has those qualities, he will be a great grihastha. But if he doesn’t learn that humility, that tolerance, that respect and all that, then if the wants to work with the woman, the woman will force him to develop those qualities. Right? Does that make sense?

So that’s the point, it’s the same principles you are teaching grihastha, you can teach a brahmachari, it’s the same thing, same thing how you teach a vanaprastha or a sannyasi, the same. It’s the culture, it’s the underpinnings of the whole culture, it just has different manifestations through which you generate it. Is that okay? Yeah? So therefore you use the same things. And you see, if a brahmachari does have it, very naturally has those 4 qualities, then he’ll always give example within the brahmachari field. But if you see they don’t develop it so easily, then you go back and forth between brahmachari and grihastha, “You don’t do this, you are not gonna make it as a brahmachari, but you are not gonna make it as a grihastha either, so you might as well learn it now. You wanna be a brahmachari, you have to learn it, you’re gonna get married, you don’t learn it now, then it’s like you want me yelling at you or you want a woman yelling at you? I yell at you, I leave your emotions alone, I squash your ego, but I leave your emotions alone. A woman will squash your ego and take your emotions and rip them into shreds. Ever been in a big office, and they have a machine, you put papers in it, they shred it. That’s it. So it’s your choice, you learn from me, or you are gonna learn from a woman! I don’t care, you wanna get kicked around like a football, doesn’t bother me at all! So you learn to be humble and respectful, or there is nothing I can do for you. Stilettos hurt.”

Translator: Stilettos?

HH BVPS Maharaja: Stilettos, these are those high-heeled shoes with a nice little point. Right? You wear some kind of big rubber thing that whack across the face, okay. Stilettos have points, they hurt more. So like that, that’s how you teach the brahmachari. They have to learn how to be good brahmacharis, or good grihasthas. Because then if they are a brahmachari, then they’ll go, “I don’t wanna do that, so therefore I’ll do this.” But if they are gonna be grihasthas, then they learn to do this and go, “Oh, that’s what you do there!” You run a serious grihastha class, you actually train brahmacharis, because a brahmachari looks at that and goes… Or let’s say you have a group of brahmacharis, and you run a grihastha class, then by the end of the class, what you’ve done if it’s been nicely operated, those who wanna be brahmachari are now determined to be brahmacharis, because they know why they wanna be brahmacharis, and those who are not sure now are willing to be grihasthas, because now they know how it works and they are not afraid of it anymore. So…Does that make sense?

Means, it’s easy to teach, “Okay, you wanna be a good brahmachari, women are terrible.” And that works great, until the day that the brahmachari meets kind-of a nice, sweet, shy girl. Then that whole theory is blown out the window. [Laughter] But if you teach them that, “Okay, you wanna deal with the woman, this is how you are gonna have to do it, so either they become comfortable with it, or they go, “No, I don’t need that.” Does that make sense? So that’s why the principle is taught all the way through. Because a fight is a fight, two brahmacharis fight, it’s the same principle how are you gonna break the fight. Someone has to be humble and sincere. You know what I am saying? So if they want to be able to do it first, they are gonna remain the brahmachari. You know what I am saying? Because brahmacharis are men. Right? So the same things work, like that, it’s the same. So you can basically teach the whole thing of the grihastha ashrama except for applying… Means, the same principles then apply into the intimacy between husband and wife, that application you don’t teach the brahmacharis. Does that make sense? So that’s different, but everything up to that, means, you use it or not, apply it or not depending upon the nature of the person. Is that okay?

Mataji: This is a very concrete situation that…

HH BVPS Maharaja: Very concrete situation?

Mataji: Not concrete, but specific…

HH BVPS Maharaja: Means, this is an engineering question, very concrete situation?

Mataji: No, specific, because in Hungarian… This is a specific question, like…

HH BVPS Maharaja: Okay. Means engineers are very specific.

Mataji: There is a couple and they got married before they joined Krishna consciousness…

HH BVPS Maharaja: The couple that got married before they joined?

Mataji: Yes. And the man…

HH BVPS Maharaja: So, I mean, that’s Vedic, you get married, then only they join together, so it’s very, very good, it’s good one, it’s not a problem… See, when they join first, then get married, that’s not so good.

Mataji: No, I mean, I will explain the situation. And they never agreed upon having children.

HH BVPS Maharaja: They never agreed on having children? Means they were always disagreeing or they both agreed that they wouldn’t have children?

Mataji: No, they were disagreeing, the man always…

HH BVPS Maharaja: They were disagreeing since they got together?

Mataji: Yes, the man from the start was saying that he would never want children, but the woman thought that it’s just the usual…

HH BVPS Maharaja: Matter of time before she convince him?

Mataji: Yeah, so but with time she saw that it’s not the case, it’s not the usual…

HH BVPS Maharaja: Did she try Half Nelson?

Mataji: No. So and you also mentioned that grihastha life is for having children, but in our disturbed society we may come from backgrounds which don’t help us becoming parents, because we don’t … We are not inspired to become parents because our background and past is so disturbed. So if woman still has a kind-of a desire to have children, but she is afraid that…. And the man is willing to, he says that he is willing to take the sacrifice, because he didn’t want children, but he may be the one who gets kind-of lost, destroyed in the process, psychologically, that it’s so detrimental for him to have children, that the woman may have children, but then she will lose the husband, because he will become a… [Laughter]

HH BVPS Maharaja: Block of concrete? [Laughter]

Mataji: So in such a situation, what should the woman, how should the woman think, should she take the risk of having children, but losing the husband because he cannot tolerate this new environment, or…

HH BVPS Maharaja: … not having the children and losing herself…

Mataji: Not I mean, not that not having children then regretting it badly. She is already old enough, so she doesn’t have many years to ponder about this question, and so risking…

HH BVPS Maharaja: Try fostering. [Laughter]

Mataji: Well, that’s the question.

HH BVPS Maharaja: Check it out, take a month for a month. Any engineers here, there is a question for you, it’s on concrete…

No, but what happens if they joined and then they got married after joining, and they still have the same viewpoint? So that’s a completely different question?

Mataji: No, it’s not, it’s just that…

HH BVPS Maharaja: So the principle is, if the husband didn’t wanna have kids, but the wife did, but she went along with it thinking she’d convince him later, and he did agree to it, but he is not sure if he can handle it, should they have the children and risk losing the husband, or not have the children and risk losing the wife?

Mataji: I just mentioned, before Krishna consciousness, because I have heard so much in Krishna consciousness is that maybe we would have thought these issues over at the beginning in a more intelligent manner, so that’s why I made…

HH BVPS Maharaja: Yes.

Translator: Should I translate your version?

HH BVPS Maharaja: [Indistinct 01:52:58] [Laughter] Because my version is her version. Less historical facts and more concretes. [Laughter].

Basically is, women mean children. So why would one marry a woman and think she wouldn’t want children? That would be one principle. If she says she doesn’t want children, it should be why she doesn’t want children, what is the reason behind it? Because the point is, if that situation changes then the viewpoint might change. Does that make sense? That’s one element.

Another element is, the relationship has developed that the husband says, okay, he’d be willing to have the children, but he doesn’t know what his reaction would be. So that would mean, if the children were had, then the wife should be the prominent one to take care of them, they shouldn’t use the French manifestation. In other words, she should basically take care, shouldn’t complain, shouldn’t try to get any more extra attention because of it. Let it come naturally, there is a Marwari saying “first take the little finger, then take the whole hand.” Right?

Mataji: Yeah.

HH BVPS Maharaja: So therefore if the man is not interested in the children, the woman shouldn’t say, “That’s okay,” if she actually wants, because there is not guarantee they will be convinced. Should be, but what if they are not? So therefore better marry someone who is interested, and even if they are interested, it should be the same, kind-of same number. One shouldn’t be thinking “one” and the other is thinking “ten”. You know what I am saying? Like that. If both of them are not interested and their reasons are similar, then either in a similar way they won’t have children, or in a similar way, as the situation adjusts, they’ll be both comfortable with it and they will. Right? But if their reasons are different or incompatible, even why they don’t want children, what if the situation changes and the one is interested and the other is not? Does that make sense? Otherwise, I don’t know, I’ve seen… What do you call it? I mean this is just in a humoristic approach, I mean, I’ve seen that on computers and different things you can get animals and take care of the animals. You know, you feed your cat and this and that, if you forgot to feed it, it dies, and then you have to start the game over again… So you could always check and see if there is such a thing as “take care of the baby”, “change the diapers”, “feed the baby”…. [Laughter]

Mataji: [Indistinct 01:58:25] real life…

HH BVPS Maharaja: You always get, go out and buy yourself a nice fuzzy Winnie the Pooh. Barbie?

Mataji: No.

HH BVPS Maharaja: You know what I am saying? So like that. [Indistinct 01:58:54] that whole page already, okay.

Mataji: Which are the steps that we have to follow and how we should behave spiritually as a couple for having Krishna conscious children?

HH BVPS Maharaja: What was the first part of the sentence?

Mataji: Which the steps that we have to follow?

HH BVPS Maharaja: Which are the steps you have to follow for being, to have Krishna conscious kids? From what I see is, basically the two of you would have to be able to cooperate together and that works very nicely. You don’t have kids, then that will hold the relationship together. Relationship has to be holdable together, then kids grow up in a nice environment. So if husband and wife can cooperate together peacefully, then they could bring up the kid. Then the other thing is plan, what kind of kid do you want? That doesn’t mean blonde hair, blue eyes [indistinct 02:00:19] What kind-of qualities you are looking for? So when they both have the same idea, then you find dates, right? And then according to those dates, then you try to have children. Because if you set a date, it kind-of takes the whole mode of passion out of it, you know, puts it in goodness. So therefore generally the child will tend to be more focused and more sattvic and less desire. But still the process remains the same, it’s a process based on passion, so, means, the point is, if the husband produces more fluids because of more passion, you get a boy. If the woman produces more, you will get a girl. If it’s equal then you’ll get either twins, a boy and a girl, or a hermaphrodite [Laughter] And if it’s not enough then there will be no conception. Does that make sense?

Mataji: Many times we get the advice not to worry so much or not to complicate things to a certain extent, anyway Krishna consciousness is simple for the simple, so what function of the mind of the women allows that we become simple and how can we become more simple?

HH BVPS Maharaja: Satisfaction. Chastity and satisfaction. Chastity means, it’s focused in one place and satisfaction means, whatever is provided then that’s good. See, there is a difference between happiness and satisfaction. Happiness means, the experience of having gained something desired. There is something you want, you get that, that’s called happiness. But it’s only the experience of having gotten it, it’s not actually the experience of having it. Do you understand? So as long as you are thinking, “I got this,” you are happy. But as soon as “I have this,” you are not happy, that’s where satisfaction is important. If you are satisfied with “What I have I am comfortable with it,” then that’s like happiness in the mode of goodness. It’s not ecstasy, but it’s very pleasant, you can get used to it. Then if you are satisfied and you put happiness on top of that, then it’s a plus. You know what I am saying? But if you are unsatisfied, how much you can sustain yourself on being happy for the moment? How often do those moments come? How much can you go shopping? Even if you go shopping, how much of the time can you find exactly what you want? And even you find what you want, how often you have the money to buy it? You know what I am saying? And even if you can buy it, how much of that can you do? How many bags or shoes, or sarees, or cars, or houses, or planes can you have and then after a while it’s… You know what I am saying?

So happiness is not the solution. Satisfaction is the solution. Then if something comes or doesn’t come, you are happy. Like that. Does that make sense? So that’s the best way. But the men should never take advantage of that. The men shouldn’t be saying, “Oh, you should be satisfied.” That’s the quality that the women themselves work on. Right? The men should be working on sensitivity that I provide what the woman needs. And need much of the time is what they want. You know what I am saying? So very important in all these instructions when we go back and forth between men and women, is men should stick to their things, women to theirs. Right? And if the women tell the men about the stuff they are supposed to do, they shouldn’t mind.

Translator: The women tell the men…?

HH BVPS Maharaja: Tell the men about the men’s duties. Men shouldn’t mind. [Laughter] But the men shouldn’t be telling the women about their duties, if it’s not done in a very pleasant, affectionate, supportive way. And especially if it’s after a moment when the problem is there, then the man should never try to explain it. Even when she is in a good mood, he shouldn’t try to explain it, otherwise there will be a bad mood. Those rare moments where, as we described before, where woman, what she thinks and what she says is the same, those are the times to explain it. But not in the way of, “I am right, you are wrong,”or “I told you so,” or any sense of justice, it’s just the time that you can be very open and explain that that’s what you actually meant. Does that make sense? So that was an example of talking to him, that was an example of instructing the daughter-in-law through the daughter. Like telling her how the men have to deal. Okay, so we’ll end here, it is the famous 3 minutes after ten, or ten after… Whatever. [Laughter]

Jaya! Grantaraja Srimad… no, it’s… [Laughter]

Srila Prabhupada ki jaya! Samaveta-bhakta-vrinda ki jaya! Jaya Nitai-Gaura-premanande Hari Haribol!

Prabhu: His Holiness Bhaktividya Purna Maharaja ki jaya!

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