This transcription is by Uddhava Priya Prabhu, used with permission from lecture folio that you can download HERE

January 27, 2009

Maharaja: From Mantras 12-14 we understood that the material energy should be studied only in connection with the Lord. 

Mantra 15 explains that one should understand Bhagavān Śrī Kṛṣṇa as the master of both the material and spiritual energies. Mantra 16 continues the prayer of the devotee for the Lord to reveal His spiritual form.

In mantra 14 it is stated:

One should know perfectly the Personality of Godhead Śrī Kṛṣṇa and His transcendental name, form, qualities and pastimes, as well as the temporary material creation with its temporary demigods, men and animals.

So here it is being brought out that you are going deeper and deeper. One is you are taking here is the Supreme Personality of Godhead and so He is the Lord of everything, that means Him and His creation. Then we are taking it a step further: now this is the devotional attitude in doing that and this is the non-devotional. So here we are bringing it to the of the person means as Bhagavan, so here name, form, qualities and pastimes and then how that reflects into the material world: How do activities, pastimes and rasa happen in the material world? 

Because that is what is going on. Everything that is there is all the field of activities. There is not something else here. Because we can say I am doing this here and there is demigods and there is this and that. But that is not a full understanding. A full understanding is that I am here, why am I here? Because of my desire. Why am I in this particular situation that I am in that is because of my karma. My previous desires and activities that put me in this situation. So now who is arranging this situation and who is controlling this situation so that it would be there for me to act in according to my karma. That is the demigods. They take care of everything in the creation to do that. So that explains the demigods. Then why these different situations? To be able to affect all these things you are going to have to that this will be carried out. The planets carry this out, so therefore you have the planets. They are to do that, to understand that they have to have directions. Because of that their influence is affected. So you have to have the directions. Then in this is that all that is done now a place all of that has to happen at a place so therefore you have planes, mountains, river, oceans etc. all different situations in which whatever situation you want can be manifest. So whatever there is of that it is going to have different levels of manifestation, so you have the 14 planetary systems. The mentality will be more towards the pious or towards the impious therefore you have the divine and the demoniac. All this is then affected through the three modes. 

You catch the idea? In other words, whatever there is in the creation is all to do with the situations that are required for the living entity to fulfill his material needs. So the ksetra and ksetra-jna, that is all there is. So demigods, the directions everything like this, the naksatras and all those kinds of things these are all ksetra. So the living entity can then either identify also as ksetra though he is claim to be the controller and enjoyer or he can understand I am not this field, I am not this body, I am not this false identity, then he can become ksetra-jna. Of course, only his ksetra. Krsna is the Supreme ksetra-jna because He knows all the ksetras. In fact, He is the origin of them. 

Devotee (1): Are the rulers of the different planets devotees of the Lord?

Maharaja: No they are just holding a post. Basically you can say to some degree. Not necessarily that they are known as that. But generally post-holders are some form of neophyte devotee

Devotee (1): And they are ruling our activities?

Maharaja: They are creating the situations for you to receive the results of your previous activity. 

Devotee (1): Can we avoid this?

Maharaja: You have dropped a glass and it is very quickly spanning the distance between your hand and the floor. What can you do about it? 

Devotee (1): So we can’t avoid it?

Maharaja: What is the need to avoid it? 

Devotee (1): To be able to do activities that is favorable for devotion

Maharaja: Ok that is the activity that is favorable towards devotion. We want to do an activity that is favorable towards devotion. Ok, but what about the devotion? Doing activities that are favorable for devotion is one thing, doing favorable devotional service is another thing.

They can be the same but in this instance we are splitting it because you may be doing the favorable activity but what is more important? You are cooking for the Lord but your mind is thinking about why did that person say that, and who are they to say this and this is unfair and unjust, and the whole time you are cooking that is all you are thinking, so what that have been a high-grade devotional activity? 

Devotee (1): By doing the 9 processes of devotional service how much the demigods can still rule our life?

Maharaja: You want to scratch your head, who picks your arm up and puts it on top of your head? Do you do that? Does one ten-thousand of a tip of a hair do that? We have trouble picking up something the same size as us. Can you turn around and one of these ladies next to you and pick them up? Now you take something that one ten-thousand of a tip of a hair, how does that pick your arm up? So who is picking it up for you? 

Devotee (1): Demigods

Maharaja: The demigods, through the planets, through the modes of nature they are doing it all. 

Devotee (1): But isn’t it that our activities are ruled by our desire?

Maharaja: Yes, but who is going to get it done. You can’t get it done. Who is going to do it for you? The small child wants to eat. So how does the food happen? Because the parent arranges it. So what’s the problem: the kid wanted to eat, so therefore the parent arranges the food. It is not a problem. 

Devotee (1): So if we do desire to perform these 9 processes of devotional service then the demigods will support our activities according to our desire?

Maharaja: Why not? But it is according to your actual desire. 

Devotee (1): I mean actual desire.

Maharaja: The point is this going back to the point we were making before, you have an activity, so what is the most important element of it: the activity itself or the devotion with which you perform the activity? 

Devotee (1): … 

Maharaja: If you would answer more directly the question. I am cooking for Krsna, what is more important: the cooking itself or my attitude when I cook? What makes it the devotion? 

Devotee (1): Attitude.

Maharaja: Yes, because the karmi is cooking also and he may cook with the same skill. They cook the same preparation but it is not devotion, it is the attitude. Therefore whatever the situation, like you said purification doesn’t come immediately, so whatever situation you are in, that has come to you as a result of your previous activities, the most important element is how you deal with that in connection with Krsna. Not whether the situation or activity is the most perfect form of expressing our devotion to Krsna. That is the whole idea therefore it doesn’t matter what the planets are doing. The planets are taking care of doing the planets, the modes, everything what we previously in the past have wanted to do and they are arranging it according to our qualification. 

So devotion means whatever situation you are in you use that for Krsna. Whether it is coming from, we have been performing very nice activities so therefore we are getting very nice results now, and those are being engaged in Krsna’s service, or in the past we haven’t performed necessarily such nice activities so we are not necessarily getting great results, but still there is not great results we are engaging in Krsna’s service. In some way or another. That is the idea. That’s why we technically don’t have to worry about the planets and all these things. They are not technically important when it comes to performance of devotional activity. 

Devotee (1): But devotees consult astrologers? 

Maharaja: Depends what they are looking for, it is an individual thing. Prabhupada mentions it that it is important that when you are arranging a marriage so you look at the charts to see that there is inherent compatibility. Because a marriage is not based on spiritual acumen. It is not that one soul is marrying another soul. No, one gross and subtle body is marrying another gross and subtle body. So you want to make sure they match. Therefore it is useful. 

But other things, for establishing the proper times to perform auspicious activities that is actually what the science is for. But it gets used because people want to know their, for whatever reason what is happening, going to happen or what has happened so then you have your interpretive sciences, which that is what it is generally known what people deal in, astrology and all those things. But actually astronomy is the main science and these are branches of astronomy. Because astronomy establishes, how do you know when Ekadasi is, or Janmastami? That is astronomy. How do you know when there is a proper time to have a samskara? That is astronomy. That is important. And astrology depending upon the individual then it may have its benefits or not.

Such transcendental realizations are possible only by Kṛṣṇa’s mercy. Therefore the concluding mantras of Śrī Éçopaniñad teach the process of gaining the Lord’s mercy by devotional prayers. 12

12 Śrīla Baladeva Vidyābhüñaëa writes in his commentary on mantra 15:

“After the Guru delineates the form of Paramātmā to the qualified disciple, the disciple engages in the selfless worship of the Lord to meet the Lord directly and then attains a liberated state. This has been described in the previous verses. But meeting the Lord directly is not possible just by sravana, manana, nidhidyasana, etc and liberation is not possible just by meeting the Lord. Only when one attains the mercy of the Lord can one attain the Lord. The concluding verses of the Upaniñad show the method of praying for the Lord’s mercy so that one may attain perception of the Lord through hearing and meditation, and so that one may attain liberation from the world through perceiving him.”Seeing the Lord in everything, so we come down to it is brought out here is that one must know the Lord, His name, form, qualities, pastimes – the element of Bhagavan. Because it is by His mercy, absorption in the Lord and His mercy that one is freed from material entanglement and established in devotional service. He is Mukunda. No one else can give liberation, no other demigod, no other planet, no ritual, nothing, only Krsna. That means then as a person we must know Krsna. 

And here liberation we talk about we mean liberation mean being established in one’s eternal relationship with Krsna because that liberation is permanent. Any other kind of liberation is temporary. Here than it is only through knowing the Lord, by serving the Lord and praying to the Lord, gaining His mercy then all these things are actually possible. In other words we are trying to create a determination that this is what I want to do: I want to engage all my activities in the Lord’s service, I want to be able to see the Lord in everything, I want to chant the pure name, I want to be able to develop my love for Krsna, free myself from material entanglement, be established in my natural position of eternal servitor. So having that determination I will engage in those activities, but to actually be able to be properly established in those and get the result is by the Lord’s mercy. 

We just say Lord’s mercy then which is fine which is the essential point but then we may just offer prayer and never do activity. Please make me your pure servant but not do anything that is service. Therefore one gains the Lord’s mercy through devotional activities, and so therefore prayer is counted as one of the devotional activities. So it makes it an activity. 

Perfect knowledge is to know Bhagavān Śrī Kṛṣṇa as the source of Brahman and Paramātmā. Brahman is the effulgence coming out from His transcendental body, and Paramātmā is His expansion.

So everything is going back to the person. So you understand the Brahman element of the material energy, you understand Paramatma, therefore whatever is there in your activities you can connect to Krsna, through Brahman and Paramatma. But they are coming from Krsna. So the idea is getting out of the material world isn’t good enough. You have to develop love for Bhagavan. So then everything must be seen in connection with Bhagavan. That’s why then the knowledge should continue until one knows that. One’s endeavor. And then by Krsna’s mercy, realizing this, then one will be absorbed in the name, form, qualities and pastimes. 

In other words, we are making the endeavor to please Krsna, Him being pleased blesses us, that we will always be engaged in His service.

In the beginning we are doing it because this is what is good for us, it is the practice. Gaining the Lord’s mercy, we are doing it because this is what we like to do. It comes natural. 

In mantras 15 and 16 the Lord is addressed as “püñan” or sustainer. The Lord pervades and supports the material creation with a single fragment of Himself (BG 10.42). He maintains everybody (eko bahünāà yo vidadhāti kāmān), but still he shows special mercy to His devotees. This is confirmed in Bhagavad-gītā:

I envy no one, nor am I partial to anyone. I am equal to all. But whoever renders service unto Me in devotion is a friend, is in Me, and I am also a friend to him.  (BG 9.29)

Here you have this special knowledge pusan, maintainer. That element maintenance is done through action. It is the most difficult of all the activities. Create, maintain and destroy: Maintenance is the most difficult because it requires the maximum amount of qualities. 

Then as the maintainer we see that all aspects are maintained. As a devotee the most important element is the attitude. That means the most important element has been maintained in the devotional life is the devotional mood. The body, the other things, that is the easy part. Maintaining the mood that is the more difficult part. 

Devotee (2): Krsna says He maintains and protects. Some devotees think that if we have some injuries He is not protecting us any more?

Maharaja: If there is injury we don’t… if He is not protecting us. That is because we are looking at the whole process as religion as opposed to devotion. Because from dharma comes artha. So if I am not getting artha then there is something wrong with the dharma. That means there is something wrong… God is not doing what He should do. 

Rather than you are getting the results of your previous activities and you are engaging whatever you have in Krsna’s service and Krsna is reciprocating with that by freeing us from the material contamination and developing our love for Him. That is the essential point. Now depending upon the individual then the process of either taking away material facilities or giving material facilities will enhance that. 

So it is like this if someone actually wants to become God conscious and they have great values in the element of facility then by taking up Krsna consciousness then by giving them facility they will have more faith in Krsna and the process. Some by taking away their facility then they start to see there is something wrong here, I am doing all this work and still nothing works, so there must be something more here because I need something that is not provided by…so then Krsna will take away then they take up Krsna consciousness. Then if the necessity is to give them facility then they become more inspired. 

Now with time by performing devotional service, or even without time if someone is actually not that sincere, they don’t actually want to be involved in Krsna consciousness, Krsna can create situation that is seemingly unfavorable and then from that one can lose one’s faith and go away. Otherwise, how are you losing faith if everything is going ok, it is hard to. It is really hard to break off a relationship if the person is nice. Either you have to make them not nice in your own mind so that you can break off the relationship, or you have to find some fault, something you have to do to even if it is something they haven’t done for ten years, ten years ago you did this, but they find something and then they can break off the relationship. Therefore if they are doing everything nicely in Krsna consciousness and they are not getting a good material result then you can find fault in Krsna and go away. 

And because the whole process is voluntary Krsna will make that arrangement. Because He says: I am impartial. I envy no one nor am I impartial to anyone. I am equal to all. So if you want to not like Him and to go away, He is impartial. He is not envious. So that is what you want then He will come to you in that form. It is still you and God. Oh God is not just not this not that. But it is still you and God. But you want to see God as not God so He will come to you in that form. So you don’t get away from Him but you in your own mind can think He is not there and it is not happening. 

Devotee (2): So we always have what we need

Maharaja: Yes, Krsna is taking care. But the point is it is the endeavor that is important. That is what is not… it is the endeavor that’s been made. If that is appreciated that is more important than what has been done. 

The meal has been cooked so the meal is the result, the fruit so that is appreciated, but more important is the endeavor that went into cooking it, or arranging it, or serving it, or whatever is the elements that are there, and why that would be there. So Krsna is looking at that: what is the mood, why one is doing something. 

The endeavor is important because only through an action do you get a result. And if we are supposed to offer the results of all our action to Krsna unless we have done an action how do you get a result? If we say body, mind and words that means they are doing something. The body does something, the mind does something, the words are doing something. Therefore then one is engaged. 

In other words, coming to the point of that Krsna is a person and not just the one who gets something done. If He is just the one that gets something done you are dealing with Paramatma. You need something in the material world, it is arranged as Paramatma. Krsna as Bhagavan means the person you want to have that affection for. So it is another stage. They are non-different technically because it is Krsna, He comes as Paramatma to arrange everything, but as long as you see that then you are dealing with Bhagavan. Brahman is Krsna’s effulgence, Paramatma is Krsna’s expansion. Then working with Brahman and Paramatma also then invokes the Bhagavan understanding, or the Bhagavan vision.

The Lord favors His devotees. He guides them and gives them the necessary knowledge to attain Him. Thus the devotees are in superior position compared to the jïānés and the yogis who depend on their own limited strength.

To those who are constantly devoted to serving Me with love, I give the understanding by which they can come to Me. To show them special mercy, I, dwelling in their hearts, destroy with the shining lamp of knowledge the darkness born of ignorance.  (BG 10.10-11)

But those who always worship Me with exclusive devotion, meditating on My transcendental form—to them I carry what they lack, and I preserve what they have.  (BG 9.22)

My dear Uddhava, the unalloyed devotional service rendered to Me by My devotees brings Me under their control. I cannot be thus controlled by those engaged in mystic yoga, Sāìkhya philosophy, pious work, Vedic study, austerity or renunciation. (SB 11.14.20)

So we see Krsna is actually very involved in the life of the devotee. It is just a matter of whether the devotee is taking advantage of that. 

The point is it brings Krsna under control. So if you are controlled by Krsna, in other words what you do is based on the principle of affection for Krsna that you are doing it because it pleases Him then He comes under your control. That is the natural relationship between a devotee and the Lord. But if you are not controlled by Krsna then He is independent how much you will be in control of Him, not much. It is something you would like to do but control is only based on relationship. Unless you have that relationship with Krsna you can’t control Him. 

The whole point is that Krsna is taking care. It says here: worship with exclusive devotion, meditating on My transcendental form. So the exclusive devotion, in general that is there, but exclusive devotion that means it is not distracted by anarthas. Meditating on My transcendental form, name form, you got to the form. 

Then that would be nistha. Because name is your general process, that is your process. Form will be nistha, qualities will be ruci because you get taste from qualities, asakti will be… I mean. No I think that will take it further. I have to check if it comes up in the Siksastika. 

The point is he is fixed in devotional service and He is absorbed in Krsna. For that person, that devotee, Krsna what they lack Krsna makes up for and what they have He preserves. Because the mood is sincere, they want to please Krsna. So there may be an occasional distraction but to Krsna it doesn’t really matter. To others it might but to Krsna it doesn’t really matter. 

Devotee (1): When we are fixed on the name and form it goes by the level from sraddha to…?

Maharaja: That is one of the aspects. Otherwise how can you be absorbed? Means in bhajana-kriya you are not really focused. So the name is there but you are not even hearing. So in that way you can put it, the name goes there, the name is there but then when it becomes nistha. 

Means you have anistha-bhajana-kriya, when it becomes nistha-bhajana-kriya then one is situated properly in chanting the holy name. So it is a neutral state. Then when one becomes attracted to the form, then because there is a taste because there is qualities there. So then from that come the qualities because the qualities are the basis of the pastimes. So then the attachment is established there. Then that brings one to pastimes where one is established in bhava-bhakti where one is absorbed in His pastimes. So you have that element. 

You can have that element happening anyway on these other levels. But it is just naturally they are there. Just like faith is always there, or taste is always there it is just a matter of what is the prominent element. It is called ruci because that is the prominent experience of the devotee. But when he first joins the temple he has an experience that is favorable, he likes, he has a taste to be in the association of devotees and take prasada and do kirtana, and hear the philosophy and read, do some service, that is why he takes it up. But that is not the prominent element, the prominent element is the faith, or the sadhu-sanga or the bhajana-kriya. So there is always that element there. 

The words “asau puruñaù so 'ham asmi” from mantra 16 do not imply that the living entity and the Supreme Lord are identical in all respects. Śrīla Bhaktivinoda Öhākura translates mantra 16 reads as follows:Because you are establishing asau purusah so’ham asmi, I am also like that. Because you have that thing: so’ham. That becomes a very important what they call maha-vakya, means great statement or great pronouncement – so’ham, I am that. Because we have this here in the Upanisad, that the impersonalist can take it this way, that’s why they can be very much absorbed in Isopanisad because they think I am that Supreme Person, I am that purusa, which is funny why do they want to be a purusa which is a person or a man when they say there is no form, there is no thing but they are happy to be Him. Once they are Him then they can say everything else is maya. So it is a little inconsistent. So to make sure that it is understood that it doesn’t mean that here or how it is meant then he is now explaining.

O Püñan, Ekarsi, Sürya, Prājāpatya, remove your rays, restrict your light. Then I can see your most auspicious form. I am qualified to see that form because you, the complete person, and Paramātmā, your portion in the material world, and we jīvas also are all spiritual by nature. If you are merciful I can see you.

This is confirmed by Vedānta Deçika who writes in his commentary:

Some claim that the sentences “tat tvam asi” and “so’ham asmi”, teach the concept of only one Brahman with no qualities, by destroying the false, illusory forms of cause (éçvara) and effect (jīva). However, like a knife, the word “asmi”, destroys this concept because it indicates the state of “my existing” even after the realization. Since the concept of “you” and “I” are supposed to be rejected by the hearer (tvam) and seeker of Brahman (aham) in these two sentences according to the proponents of this philosophy, there can be no one who is enlightened by the state of tvam asi “your existing” and there can be no one seeking Brahman by the state of aham asmi “my existing”. (Thus the statement would be useless).

So you have tvam asi and ham asmi. If it is true that there is no creator and created that it is all one then you couldn’t have you and I. The point is here that they are claiming that this tat tvam asi or so’ham asmi, or the tvam asi and aham asmi, that the elements are there at the point of realization. I understand, I’m realized aham asmi. You can’t have that because that is still defining that you are you and that is that. If I say there is no Lord and no living entity and the Lord is the tvam and the living entity is the aham, so when you become realized this would disappear. So if it disappears then how could you say tat tvam asi, or so’ham asmi? So if you are saying that then by their philosophy that means you are not realized. The point is in this statement how I can be that because I am that, but they are saying that this is the platform of realization. But you can’t have that on the platform of realization because according to their philosophy it is all one. So they are contradicting themselves by saying this. They can say one will come to understanding that all is one but to say I become that, how can you become that because then they are saying that there is a I and there is a that and I become that. 

But if they are actual Brahmavadis there is not I there is no that it is all just Brahman. So they wouldn’t use these statements. They wouldn’t use so’ham asmi because there wouldn’t be an I. It is illusory that there is anyway so why would I talk about it on the platform of realization? Why would I even say I am that? No, it is all one. So they contradict themselves. 

So these are the maha-vakyas on which their philosophy is based. In this way the Vedanta-desika shows that therefore their philosophy doesn’t have a standing because sastra quotes it is based upon don’t support their philosophy, it supports another understanding. In other words, their understanding doesn’t have a sastric basis. It is just to make it very clear that this so’ham asmi here is not the same that the impersonalists try to use. 

Devotee (3): So what does this statement actually mean?

Maharaja: The general would be that there is the gold and the gold mine, or the drop of water has the same quality as the ocean itself. Or He is eternal, we are eternal but He is the supreme eternal, He takes care of all the individual eternals. In that way then there is a oneness. But at the same time to say I am that means that there is two. In the context that there is two there is a oneness. Oneness in quality but not in quantity. 

Based on that if two then this point is being made. So therefore if two are there then the only oneness that can be there is quality. It can’t be identity otherwise why would you say I and you, or I and that? Because you are already establishing that there is two. Then having established that there is two now you are saying that I am that. This would mean it has to be qualities. 

It is not like saying, they think one person wrote them a letter and you are… they are talking to them, no but you say I am the person who wrote that letter but it is the same identity, so that is different. But here it is I am that because that is different than I then we have to conclude that it is based on qualities. 

Devotee (3): No preacher of Mayavada philosophy is ever realized? 

Maharaja: Yes, that is correct. Because Lord Siva is a Vaisnava. So he is realized but because of Vaisnavism. He did that to trick the people. See, people were Buddhists so they don’t believe in the Vedas so that is a big problem. Because if you want to establish Vaisnavism you have to have the Vedas. Now they believe that there is nothing. So you can adjust that nothing into there is something but that is just Brahman. But because it is I am trying to extinguish my existence and having extinguished it I am successful, it is still the basic bogus foundation. So then you have to make something that is supported by the Vedas because the void is not supported by the Veda. There is no such a thing as the void there is always something, even if you say nothing is there space is there. So it is an energy of the Lord. So then you can have that. So you give the Mayavada-philosophy then it is based on Vedic principles, lifestyle, sastras, processes everything but it is still Buddhist philosophy technically. We call them impersonalists but technically they are Buddhists. It is a slight transformation of it. 

They are not real impersonalists. Because real impersonalists there is no need to preach because everything is one anyway, they are already Brahman, whether they understand it or not. So Brahman is already happening. So since your goal is Brahman it is already going on. So there can be variety in Brahman but it is still Brahman. But they are saying that there is no variety, so where is such a thing as no variety? Where is there is no qualities and no forms, that doesn’t exist such a place. So that is bogus. But everything is Brahman that is bona fide. Krsna is Brahman, internal potency is Brahman, the jivas are Brahman, the material energy is Brahman. It is all Brahman. So that is bona fide. But it is only the basic stage of spiritual understanding. But Mayavada is just bogus. They study sastra, they do pious activities in that way, they will be absorbed in the austerity and other things, that will be beneficial, but still as far as getting liberation and all that that won’t happen. 

Devotee (3): What is the technical difference between a Mayavada and a Brahmavada?

Maharaja: Brahmavadi is on the Brahman platform and a Mayavadi is in maya. Because they say everything is illusion. But everything is not illusion. There is illusion but to say that God and the jiva are illusion that is an illusion. So they are in maya. 

Devotee (1): Why would one become this? It is natural to be a devotee.

Maharaja: That is a question you have to ask each individual. But the difficulty is that the soul is naturally a devotee but the soul has developed a mentality to become the controller and enjoyer. That is not devotional. 

Devotee (1): Are the Mayavadis trying to become something or are they just rejecting the material?

Maharaja: They reject material but how do they greet each other? Namo Narayana. I offer my respect to Narayana. So they are all, everybody is Narayana. Everybody is God. If we say jaya Radhe or jay Nitai they say namo Narayana. They have issues. They have some serious, in the anartha category, misgivings. (end of lecture)

Devotee (3):

Maharaja: It is not that the Brahmavadi knows that there is such a thing as the transcendental holy name. For him everything is transcendental. The Deity is also transcendental…they don’t make a distinction…they just know everything is Brahman, The Mayavadis will say these are just illusory concepts… 

Devotee (3): A Brahmavadi accepts Krsna’s name, form, qualities and pastimes are transcendental, eternal

Maharaja: Yes. But they see it all as Brahman. They don’t know that there is a Bhagavan understanding. It is not that they say Brahman realization is higher than Bhagavan realization because they don’t know that Bhagavan realization is. So whatever they see anything it is all Brahman. They are not worried about variety, they worry about Brahman…

Devotee (3): What are the respective destinations?

Maharaja: One is the brahmajyoti, and the other is stays in the material world, it says they go to the most hellish regions, because they say Krsna has no form then why would they have form? 

Devotee (3): Prabhupada says Mayavadis get…but they fall back down.

Maharaja: You can say that but we use also Mayavadi just meaning impersonalist. 

Devotee (3): Not just the follower of Sankaracarya.

Maharaja: No. If you want to buy a blue detergent for washing your clothes it is called surf, it doesn’t have what company it is, it is called surf. But it’s actually surf is one brand. 

Devotee (3): Will the Brahmavadis fall down? 

Maharaja: Yes. How will they stay in Brahman?

Devotee (3): So all Brahmavadis fall down?

Maharaja: Anybody who comes to the Brahman platform will fall from there because you have to do some activity. The jiva by nature is sac-cid-ananda, Brahman is sat. They can’t stay.

Devotee (3): Bhurijana Prabhu made the comment when Brahmavadis merge into Brahman because they are fixed in that realization Krsna allows them to stay there. 

Maharaja: They can stay there for some time but then they have to come back, they can’t stay there. It is unnatural for the jiva. So they’ll come back to activity. Whatever their activity was before they come back to that. It is not in our time line that they fall down, it is on the cosmic time frame. 

Devotee (3): So that will be a very long time. 

Maharaja: Yes, it is a very long time. But because they are working on that time platform for them it is just a short time. But for us it is a long time. For Indra it is a day there and a year here. For us we will say it is a long time but for him it is only a day. But a day of Brahma, 1000 yugas, for him it is just a day, 24 hours, but for us it’s billions…of years. The point is it is a long time compared to us but for the person who is experiencing he’ll go it won’t be so long. 

Devotee (3):

Maharaja: Yes, he can’t stay there… (end)

(27th Jan 2009, Śrī Īśopaniṣad Lecture #32, Bhaktivedānta Academy, Śrīdhāma Māyāpura)

This transcription is by Uddhava Priya Prabhu, used with permission from lecture folio that you can download HERE

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