Apasampradāyas #4

Full Playlist of Apasampradāyas Lectures 

Use your browser search function* to search for keywords within the lecture transcription. You can click anywhere in the audio track to jump to the respective section of the transcription text, and click anywhere in the transcription text to jump to the respective section in the audio track.
*CTRL+F on Windows, CMD+F on Mac, Find in/on Page on phone

DISCLAIMER: This is an automatic transcription which contains some misspellings and other irregularities. When in doubt, compare with the audio. If you would like to help us edit these transcriptions, please write to bvps.transcriptions[at]gmail.com

Hare Kṛṣṇa, Hare Kṛṣṇa, Kṛṣṇa Kṛṣṇa, Hare Hare, Hare Kṛṣṇa, Hare Kṛṣṇa, Kṛṣṇa Kṛṣṇa, Hare Hare, Hare Rāma, Hare Rāma, Rāma Rāma, Hare Hare.

The link between nāma-parādha and full-blown deviation from the sampradāya is indicated by Śrīla Jīva Gosvāmī, who warns in the Bhakti-saṅdhārbha that there are offenders to the holy name who are arcikṣṭa, arcikicya, or incorrigible.

Jñāna-lava-durvidha-dhastra-arcikicya-atva-dupeksa.

Devotees, always compassionate, try to help fallen souls with good instruction. But if someone becomes insolent and arrogant due to acquiring a little knowledge from their association, he is disqualified from the sampradāya because of three kinds of nāma-parādha, sādhu-ninda, blasphemy of the devotees of the Lord, guru-avajjā, disregard of the spiritual master, and śruti-śāstra -ninda, blasphemy of the revealed scriptures.

Yet the incorrigible offender never concedes the fact of his offenses. He cannot understand the mercy of the spiritual master, and the association of pure devotees are indispensable to the chanting of the holy name. Because he highly values worldly knowledge and accomplishments, he looks down upon the simple devotees who have surrendered themselves to devotional service. This is sādhu-ninda. He cannot accept that the spiritual master is a transcendental teacher, not a worldly one. Thus he tries to measure the person and the instructions of the guru by his own mental standards. This is guru-avajjā. He studies the revealed scriptures as he would ordinary literature, gleaning from it whatever seems to support his preconceived notions, heedless of the rest. This is śruti-śāstra-ninda.

So here is then the person who is performing nāma-parādha. Then, if they don’t have these problems, it doesn’t mean that they may not always follow the order of the guru, or may not understand things in śāstra, or don’t bicker with the other devotees, but he’s not taking this as a main platform. You can see that, okay, sometimes something’s wrong, or something like this. But here’s someone who then doesn’t see the importance. Their own intelligence, their own perception on it is actually the main thing. So therefore, the position of the ācārya, the position of the Vaiṣṇavas, the position of the scripture is not the most prominent or driving element. And because of that, then they separate themselves actually from the sampradāya. Because, as we see here, they read the scriptures, but just take what they like and leave the rest. That’s what we saw before in the six systems of the Vedic philosophy, is they’re taking it from scripture, it’s based on Veda, whatever they consider as their evidence, right? It goes back to the Veda, it’s all real evidence. But the problem is, is they only choose which evidence supports what they want. Everything else they leave. Does that make sense? You know, like you have an example of that you’re trying to establish that you don’t need to have a spiritual master, you’ll just directly take initiation from Prabhupāda. So they’ll base it on a letter. Even though you can give so much evidence from the books and other things, that won’t be accepted. It has to be a letter.

Does that make sense? So this is that kind of aspect, where you only accept which parts you like and everything else you reject. So then that’s there. Or the devotees, because, you know, they’re simple like that, they’ve taken shelter of the Lord, they’re performing their devotional activities, but they may not have great knowledge or be necessarily that thoughtful about the process. They just have faith, they just do it, so you consider them not so developed. Because here you have, you’re thoughtful, right, because you’re making up your own system, right? To make up your own system means you have to be thoughtful, but it’s just that you’re applying the thoughtfulness improperly, right? Others aren’t, they’re just going along with the system, so, you know, they’re not, you don’t consider them special. So then that’s inappropriate, right? And then the spiritual master’s instructions, then you look at him and you judge by your own. So in the same way, what you like, what you don’t like, it’s just on your own decision, it’s not by what is the standard, therefore, even if you don’t see it that way, but you want to develop seeing it that way, understand? So there’s a difference between that there’s difficulties, but, you know, the faith is there and you continue on in the devotional process, or that difficulties are there, but you think those difficulties are actually your qualifications.

Does that make sense?

Yes. Namaparada is like a misgiving?

Namaparada can be anything. It means the specific one. Yes, you would say it’s misgivings, but the misgivings, you take it that the misgivings are real, have substance, and that they’re actually something to judge from. It means people may do that, but it’s not that they so much necessarily notice it. You know what I’m saying? Just the conditioning is there, so you just continue in your conditioning as you always have, and then you’ve added Krishna consciousness, so sometimes they conflict, right? Because you have the pure devotional service, and then the material, so it makes for that mixed devotional service. But here it’s not that what your point is, is that this is the most, how do you say it, the misgiving, it’s there, but you don’t necessarily notice it. Here the person is noticing their misgiving, and then making it that that is the standard by which you judge devotional service. Yes. You know what I’m saying? So you can see is that there’s very nice, you can see, okay, you can understand someone is not situated in offenseless chanting, but they’re still situated in devotional service. And then it’s very obvious, you know, those who are completely, you know, an apasampradaya, the difficulty would be what’s in between, right? But the basic point is in between is what is connected is proper, and what’s not is not. So there may be more proportion of not, or more proportion of connected, but still it’s considered within the sampradaya. You know, you’re just not so nicely situated. Does that make sense? So anything in between, you don’t count it that they’re from the apasampradaya, you count it that they’re within the sampradaya. Does that make sense?

Yes. Yes. What’s their determination? So in other words, if their determination is there with discussion, this, no, this, no, this is my perspective is correct. And then there’s going to be a difficulty there. Then it’s just a matter of do they just go out of devotional service, or do they actually, in going out, maintain a so -called practice of devotional service?

Does that make sense? Yes. So generally, you see, this means it’s not so often that having given up the determined practice of devotional service that very many create their own practices. You know, most just go back to whatever is their previous condition, right? But you see, some, having come to the mundane platform, then they create their own process and are actually able to continue with it, right? So that’s specifically your apasampradaya.

Does that make sense? Because generally, someone, when they drop to the mundane platform, we just say that they fell down, right? But now in that fallen position, no, now they make up a new, their own thing. That’s where your apasampradaya. Because most people come to that, and then you just disappear. And after a while, they figure out, this is stupid, and then they come back to Krishna consciousness. But this is, they’ll never figure out it’s stupid, because they think they have their own process.

Does that make sense? Yes.

Yes, so he’s used many times this point, incorrigible offender. If, on the strength of a false show of advancement in Krishna consciousness, he pretends to have fully realized the glories of the holy name, he is fit for eternal punishment by Yamaraja. As explained in the purport, means he’s fit for eternal punishment, but no one gets eternal punishment. You know what I’m saying? You’re fit for that. You know? But, you know, you just get whatever’s your time. As explained in the purport of Caitanya-caritamrta, Madhya-lila 19, 156, one who, quote, thinks that he has become very mature and can live separate from the association of Vaishnavas, and thus give up all the regulative principles, end quote, commits hatamata, or mad elephant offense. Whatever genuine devotional inspiration that might have been implanted in his heart by good association is uprooted and destroyed. Because of his incurable kalumni, such a hard -hearted achikitsya namaparadi is fit to be shunned by the bona fide community of devotees.

So that’s the devotional service. You perform devotional service, the result’s not lost. Even if one doesn’t, gives up practice. But, here in this case, it’s because one is offending the devotees. The point, he gives up the process, offends the devotees, then that can uproot. Does that make sense? So you make these points that it never happens. But, technically, it can, because it’s a mathematical option.

Does that make sense? But the point is, generally, that doesn’t happen. But if someone takes up this attitude, that’s why the offensiveness to the devotees is so much spoken about, because that’s the only thing that can.

Does that make sense?

Yes.

Yes, yes, yes. Because then it’s like, I think Prabhupada was talking about, when Babaji is that, he was there and some others were there, but the others became more prominent.

So then, somehow or another, for that need of prestige in that, he created his own mantra.

And so that set him aside as unique from the others, because everyone was chanting Hare Krishna. So he made up his own mantra, and that gave him his unique position.

And because it’s not coming in the line, it has that bogus element, then that always makes it so much more attractive to the materialists.

That’s why we are not worried about volume of people.

The idea is that Krishna consciousness is spread to everybody, but it’s not about that it’s spread to everybody, that’s a success. That persons have taken up pure devotional service, that’s a success. So if even one person has taken up pure devotional service, that’s a success. But if you can get more, then it’s more of a success. But it’s not that only when there’s great volumes of people, that’s a success. Isn’t it so?

Yes.

So therefore then there’s that need for that prestige in that, so they find it by creating their own.

And then it’s unique, it’s different, and so they’re recognized for that. And those who are materialists, but so-called seemingly want something spiritual, but don’t actually, then are attractive.

Because they can still maintain their mundanity, but present it as if it’s spiritual.

Is that what you’re saying?

Yes. It seems like some Upasankha Daya is created by neophytes, because then Madhyam and Uttama wouldn’t be really… No, no. Yeah, it means they’d all be created by neophytes. So he’s giving the point here, it appears that they have actually started in contact with the bona fide devotees, but due to their pride, due to their material desires, they become offensive and, how do you say, they become fixed in their offensiveness.

So they go from bona fide neophyte to bogus Madhyama.

They become fixed in their own bogus philosophy.

So then, yeah, but by this explanation that Jiva Goswami is giving, is they all started in some proper place, with proper Vaishnavas and proper study of scriptures, but their conclusions from that were improper and therefore they started their own line.

Is that what you’re saying? Yes. So then in connection with the yesterday discussion about intention, so can we say the intention wasn’t pure in the beginning or it might change in the process? It might change, it might be in the beginning, but it might change in the process.

Because intention is something very subtle, you can’t really tell what person is practicing for. Yes, that’s fair, but you generally get symptoms, you can tell the mood or the flavor of what they’re doing, the consistency of it.

So there’s symptoms you can go by. So if the symptoms basically seem to be that the motive is pure, then you take it in that way. But if you see there’s a lot of symptoms that are not, then you’re going to analyze it more and see more carefully how it’s… In other words, is there elements of the pure devotional practice, or is that only when people are watching? You know, and stuff like that. You know, little, little things like that. You know, it’s just like… I forget who it was, maybe Achutananda or something was saying… You saw once there was this… They’d have these big kirtan programs, and whoever arranges the programs, they hire so many kirtan groups. They generally do, like, three hours at a time. So if you had eight groups, you can do 24 hours.

And somehow or another it was that before this one group went on stage, then the lead singer, you know, the lead of the group, was taking chilies and putting them up his nose.

Right? Because then that would create tears. So they go on the stage. It’s not that he’s crying backstage. He’s only crying in public.

You understand? That’s the thing, so you don’t…

That’s a really tough nose.

Nonetheless, it is seen that some achikitsya namaparatis become very influential in the Kali Yuga. Somehow or other they use the use of the bona fide spiritual master for their own ends.

Advertising themselves as his dear most disciples, they seem to serve, glorify and worship the spiritual master with considerable sincerity. But all pains taken by them are for the sake of self-promulgation alone. Their progress is in the accumulation of material wealth and fame, not in devotional service to Kṛṣṇa. The achikitsya namaparati propelled to prominence by cunning, diplomacy and material qualifications like noble birth, opulence, erudition and beauty may attract followers from the ranks of two lesser grades of namaparatis who have not firmly taken shelter of the Sampradaya due to misfortune. These two kinds of offenders are the ignorant and the weak.

The ignorant offenders are compared to damp wood. Lacking bhakti-sukṛti and the association of mercy of the saintly, they are sunk in material conceptions. Even if they are exposed to the purifying fire of Kṛṣṇa consciousness, it does not ignite their good fortune immediately. Thus they are liable to be misled. But if they take refuge in the holy name, Kṛṣṇa’s mercy will suddenly be available to them, even after a long time. So such a person, there’s not so much sukṛti, so there’s not much drive, but they’re comfortable being around devotees, but it doesn’t actually start that intense desire to be absorbed in Kṛṣṇa consciousness. So such a person, like that, then may get easily distracted by these others, because why aren’t they taking up Kṛṣṇa consciousness? Because of material considerations. So here’s someone who’s presenting material considerations, but in the guise of devotional service. Right? So that will be attractive to them. So they get misled. Yes? Questioner 2 This way the difficulty comes from too much karma again, that then this will come out. If it’s either too much karma, too much karma, without the tinge of bhakti, then after some time I come out that you’re attached to the knowledge, you’re attached to the opulence, and then you’re struck with deviance. Prabhupāda Yes, yes. You’re talking about the person who starts it, or the person who follows it? Questioner 2 But I guess the person who started will know. Prabhupāda Yes, the person who started just has a little bit more drive.

Others, they become interested. But with time they can also, because here you see it’s not uncommon in these, because of the noble birth, opulence, erudition and beauty. Many times you see those who are involved in, at least leaders within these upper sampradāya movements, have some or many of these.

Because otherwise, what’s the attractive feature? Because it’s not pure bhakti. So it’s going to be something else.

The weak are hesitant to take advantage of genuine sādhu-saṅga due to a paucity of faith. Innocent and without duplicity, the more they can simply surrender to the chanting of the holy name and good association, the more they are blessed by Kṛṣṇa’s mercy. But until their lingering sins are destroyed by the effects of sādhu-saṅga, they cannot muster the strength to transcend nāma-parādha. So it means that there’s innocent and without duplicity, but the sins that are there in the heart, they are not attracted to devotional service.

But they’re innocent.

Does that make sense? So then if they get good association with time, then they’ll become fixed in devotional service. But if they don’t, they can easily get distracted by an apasampadāya.

The cikitsya nāma-parādhi expertly spins a net of illusion, illusion, sticky sweet, with a perverted enjoying mood, prakṛta-rasa, by which he entraps his unfortunate followers. So you present the philosophy, whatever are the weaknesses, then they’re intelligent enough to think of ways to explain it, so that it is able to look very attractive.

And the taste you can get from its material, so immediately you can get taste. It’s not based on transcendental flavor.

So immediately you can move forward, immediately you can be very advanced, means that they’re displaying as if they’re very advanced when they’re just at a beginning stage. So that would be very attractive.

Because bona fide line, it takes time to become advanced, but here you can become advanced very quickly. Yes. What I do, it seems that in all of this discussion, one important principle seems to come out of proper discrimination, but how does one develop that proper discrimination so that they’re not wavering towards all of these other… Means the association of the proper sadhu-saṅgha, that’s always the key. Because if you have proper sadhu-saṅgha, then you will naturally move forward. The heart becomes purified, and that taste for Kṛṣṇa consciousness arises. But if you don’t have proper sadhu-saṅgha, then that’s where the weakness… So here’s the acyakītya-nāma-parādhi.

The point is that he doesn’t have that interest.

There is a material drive to it. So he creates his own. In other words, there’s that interest in the concept of Kṛṣṇa consciousness, but not how it’s being practiced, so therefore he creates his own. So then it appears as if it’s Kṛṣṇa consciousness.

Awakening and nourishing seeds of worldly desire, anarthas, within their hearts, he misleads them into thinking that these growing anarthas are the bhakti-lata -bīja. Because the anartha, as it grows, he just makes it seem that is the bhakti-lata -bīja. As the material desires are getting more and more. So if you’re cultivating the actual bhakti-lata -bīja, then you find these anarthas, if they’re growing, it’s a disturbance. Right? But here they’re just taking it, no, that’s the bhakti-lata-bīja. So then it makes it very easy. So it appears it’s very simple and straightforward, he’s not going to talk about it. What’s that? Is that what he said? So here’s a quote from Caitanya-caritamrta.

Bhakti-lata-bīja means, quote, the seed of devotional service, end quote. Everything has an original cause or seed. For any idea, program, plan or device, there is first of all the contemplation of the plan, and that is called bīja, or the seed. The methods, rules and regulations by which one is perfectly trained in devotional service constitute the bhakti-lata-bīja, or the seed of devotional service. This bhakti-lata-bīja is received from the spiritual master by the grace of Kṛṣṇa. So it’s also the grace of Kṛṣṇa. So if someone actually wants devotional service, they’ll come in contact with the bona fide spiritual master and take it seriously and surrender. If they’re not interested, then they may come in contact, but not take it up properly. And if they’re actually not interested at all, then they won’t come in contact with the bona fide spiritual master, they’ll come in contact with the acikitsa-nama-parādhi.

Other seeds are called anyabhilasa-bīja, kama-bīja, jñāna-bīja, or political and social or philanthropic -bīja.

However, bhakti-lata-bīja is different from these other bījas. Bhakti-lata-bīja can be received only through the mercy of the spiritual master. Therefore, one has to satisfy the spiritual master to get bhakti-lata-bīja.

Bhakti-lata-bīja is the origin of devotional service. Unless one satisfies the spiritual master, he gets the bīja, or root cause, of karma, jñāna, and yoga without the benefit of devotional service.

However, one who is faithful to a spiritual master gets the bhakti-lata-bīja.

This bhakti-lata-bīja is received and was initiated by the bona fide spiritual master. After receiving the spiritual master’s mercy, one must repeat his instructions. And this is called śrāvaṇa-kīrtana, hearing and chanting. One who has not properly heard from the spiritual master, who does not follow the regulative principle, is not fit for chanting, kīrtana. So first you hear, then you can chant.

This is explained in Bhagavad-gītā, 241.

Vyavasāyātmika-bhūdhir, a.k.a. hakuru-nandana. One who has not listened carefully to the instructions of the spiritual master is unfit to chant or preach the cult of devotional service.

One has to water the bhakti-lata-bīja after receiving instructions from the spiritual master. Caitanya-caritāmṛta, Madhya-līlā, 1952, purport.

Yes, so here, unless one satisfies the spiritual master, he gets the bīja, or root cause, of karma, jñāna and yoga, without the benefit of devotional service. So one may come in contact with the bona fide spiritual master, but one has to try to follow the instructions, practice the instructions. By sincerely trying to do that, then one moves forward, one gets that seed of devotion, because when one comes in contact, one gets initiated, one moves forward. All this, the progress is naturally there. But if one is not trying to actually please the spiritual master, get his mercy, then one can end up just getting the seed of karma, jñāna and yoga. Does that make sense? Because we’re performing activities, karma. We’re learning knowledge, jñāna. We’re trying to make a connection, yoga. But they don’t actually… The activity is not seen in connection with the Lord. The knowledge is not seen in connection with the Lord. Does that make sense? The connection… Yoga is not in connection with the Lord. So that’s all you get, because you can say, well, how would you get these others? Because devotional service means all these activities. And so those activities are meant for devotional service. Problem comes is when they’re not used for devotional service. Does that make sense? All right. Someone was mentioning that some devotees said there are members who are doing service but not chanting. So is that what will happen? And Prabhupāda said that’s because they want to go to the celestial…

Yeah, because then you’re doing karma, but you’re not actually engaged in the main. It means you’re doing it for Kṛṣṇa. But the point is that it’s the chanting of the holy name that’s the main process. So they’re becoming purified. There is that element of devotional service, the bhakti-sukṛti. But basically through bhakti then they’re trying to elevate themselves to the heavenly planets. It’s not necessarily that they have that determination. It’s just that they want material facilities.

So someone who worships Kṛṣṇa with that attitude, then will get to heavenly planets because devotional service is so much more powerful than the process of karma. So it’s not that they have to do these big yajñas and everything like that. Just the devotional service will help.

Does that make sense? But you see, doing that then with time, then they start taking up chanting seriously. Then it’s just this natural progress. So in the beginning it’s always delicate because the material is the major element. And then there’s just that little seed. So that has to be water.

Does that make sense? So then slowly, slowly it will develop. And then it becomes good.

In the Āpa-sampradāyas, chanting and preaching are never undertaken with regard for Vaiṣṇava traditions of regular principles and spiritual instructions.

The ecstasy of prakṛti-rasa generated by such unauthorized chanting and preaching is but poison in devotional guides.

Instead of awakening real love for Kṛṣṇa, such hearers of the Bhāgavatam become more and more attracted to household affairs and sex life.

One should hear Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam from a person who has no connection with material activities or in other words, from a Paramahamsa, Vaiṣṇava.

That’s why it’s so important, the purports. Because you can read Vedic literature on its own, but the problem is, is without the purports, how do you actually understand how to interpret it?

That’s the importance. How do you interpret that particular verse? Therefore, that’s why the Bhaktivedanta purports. Because then you’re hearing from this Paramahamsa, Vaiṣṇava, right? Does that make sense? And then others, they help you to understand this purport of the Paramahamsa, Vaiṣṇava. Does that make sense?

So, that’s the beauty of it. If someone’s a Paramahamsa, then it just makes it so much easier for you to understand. If they’re not still, they can help you understand. That’s the perfection of when you have the founder, Ācārya, and then everybody is assisting him. Because whether you’re associating with a Paramahamsa or not, you’re still getting the association of the Paramahamsa through the instructions.

Does that make sense? So it’s perfect. That’s why we see that the Ācāryas, they all establish missions. Because in that mission, what’s the main point of the mission? It’s association.

Does that make sense? So you’re regularly hearing and chanting based on the instructions of the founder.

So then it works. It’s effective. Does that make sense? So that’s what the institution is for. Then if we ourselves, any difficulty in the institution, basically is due to our own weaknesses, not because of what the Ācāryas established. It was very interesting. I don’t know what his name is.

I can’t remember the Mahārāja. Śrānti Chopati.

I always say Bhakti, but they’re all Bhakti. Bhakti Rasamṛta Mahārāja. Yes, Bhakti Rasamṛta Mahārāja. So he was pointing out a very interesting thing on the word saṅgha. Because we’ve heard it. But there’s two spellings of it. One was just G and one is GH. So saṅgha, with just the G, that means devotees getting together, hearing, chanting, like this. Saṅgha, with the H. That is the institution in which, the organization in which you can get together.

Does that make sense? In other words, you can just get together, but if there’s an organization there to see that you get together, that’s saṅgha. So the institution is meant for saṅgha.

The whole idea of the institution is so everyone associates together. So you create an institution to make sure that regular hearing and chanting and Vaiṣṇava association is happening. So his point is that if the institution’s not establishing saṅgha, then the prominence has been missed. If you think the organization is the prominent thing, then you’ve missed the point. No, the organization is to see that saṅgha is going on.

Then within saṅgha you can see the points you’ve been making. The culture, the etiquette.

So then the institution is supposed to see that that goes on nicely.

The word saṅgha has maybe been mistranslated into meetings, like a saṅgha in the Sthitka, but it means meetings. Yeah, it just means association. It can be. What it means, all these, is that you’re getting together, but then you’re getting together for what? Is it for managerial? Is it for this or that? Point is, as long as ultimately it’s connected to Kṛṣṇa, it still has that effect. But what one should understand is that all these secondary elements are always there to support the primary of the devotional practice and attitude.

So then what mediums you’re using, this and that, you always have to understand is secondary. Secondary can be very prominent, but it doesn’t mean that it itself should take the prominence over. You understand? Prominent by time, but it doesn’t mean it takes prominence by effect.

So if one can discern that, then it always works nicely.

When Acharya is founding one institution, the institution must provide saṅgha, are there other ways that the members can be the institution?

It’s not a matter of leaving the institution. It’s a matter of if the saṅgha is not there, then make the saṅgha happen. If you’re a member of the institution, then if the saṅgha is not going on, then help see that it’s doing what it’s supposed to.

You know what I’m saying? It’s just like, let’s say you have four or five cooks in the kitchen, and so if one of the cooks is not cooking, that doesn’t mean all the others, then they also leave. No, it’s just you make it happen. That’s the best thing, because the Acharya has made it to create association.

So that’s the major point. But Prabhupāda found that in working with the institution of his spiritual master, he always tried to work with it, but it was not… He was finding difficulty to establish that association on that kind of what he was trying to affect. So then the need was there to create something. But the idea was that it would always be connected with the others. But when they weren’t interested, then it became its own. Does that make sense? But it wasn’t that as soon as there’s an obstacle, then create something else. No, he was trying since, how do you say, basically for thirty years to try to make it work.

Yes. We see also that there is in ISKCON, you said Prabhupāda was training thirty years, but we see also after Prabhupāda left, there is somebody, his disciple, who complained to similar things, that they try so much with the ISKCON, and then either a year or ten years or something like that, but they kind of… It means if they go and do their own practices, then fine. But, you know, they don’t necessarily need to start something. Whatever it is. The point is, is ultimately it doesn’t matter if it’s connected to the Lord. But the point is, is if the Ācārya’s system is working, why not take advantage of it? You know what I’m saying? Because it’s very hard to do something on your own. Prabhupāda could do that. He is Ācārya. But in their case, what it means then? It just means that if they have difficulty working with others, then on their own be Kṛṣṇa conscious. Point is, is be Kṛṣṇa conscious. But it’s always going to be stronger to be Kṛṣṇa conscious in association. But the point is, is one should understand the institution is to create association.

And interact nicely with the… Yes, yes. And not make the philosophy out of it that, oh, I cannot deal with that, I try so hard… Yeah, that’s there. It happens. The point is, is that if they’re continuing in Kṛṣṇa consciousness, just what are they going to do? They’re going to continue in Kṛṣṇa consciousness based on Prabhupāda’s instructions. Right? And then try to follow it in whatever way they can. So then they do that. Because eventually by doing that, one becomes purified, and one is able to appreciate that association.

Does that make sense? So that’s different from here, is one isn’t actually interested in that. One has one’s own idea how one wants to conduct oneself. So he presents as if he’s following the ācārya, but he’s actually not.

Yeah, does that make sense?

Okay.

One should hear Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam from a person who has no connection with material activities, or in other words, from Paramahamsa, Vaiṣṇava, who’s achieved the highest stage of sannyāsa. This, of course, is not possible unless one takes shelter at the lotus feet of Śrī Caitanya Mahāprabhu. Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam is understandable only for one who can follow in the footsteps of Śrī Caitanya Mahāprabhu. So that leaves it in his line.

Okay. In their, quote-unquote, ecstasy, the apasampradāyas enjoy the holy dharma, or a place they claim is dharma. It’s a facility for hucksterism.

Good word. Hucksterism, self-promotion and money-making. I’m not sure if hucksterism means self-promotion and money-making, or for hucksterism and then for self-promotion and then money-making.

Hucksterism is how to put a scam together. Is how to put a scam together. Oh, okay, okay.

Huckleberry, let’s put it into the name Huckleberry. Oh, really? Huckleberry Finn. Oh, really? He was good at creating situations of his own concoction. Okay.

So you’re saying Huckleberry Finn was an apasampradāya?

That’s why he was so attractive when I met him? And he was from Finland.

Yeah? He was Finnish? Finn. Finn. I’m Finnish. We are Finnish Finn. Okay. Not Swedish, but Finnish. Okay.

Same for us, but…

Okay.

Okay. They enjoy disciples by diverting them from the Lord’s service and engaging in the service of the senses of cheating gurus. They enjoy great Vaiṣṇavas through lip service and cheap imitation. Eager to bewilder the innocent and advance their own schemes, they strive for some kind of recognition from a great Vaiṣṇava so they can freely exploit this endorsement. And they enjoy propagating esoteric doctrines of their own invention that they claim are the real teachings of gurus, sadhu and śāstra.

There was a time when all these Māyāvādīs and yogis, they invited Prabhupāda to speak here because they wanted his endorsement. He’s been doing well. So they wanted the Bhaktivinoda, the Swami to come, you know. But then he came, you know, and he spoke, and he was like reading kīrtana and everything, and he’s like just smashing the Māyāvādīs directly, you know, like this, you know. So it kind of backfired, but that was the case where they were looking for him. Oh, they were looking for that. Yeah, this is when something becomes prominent. Then they want to connect, and then everybody…

All these results in three kinds of inauspicious qualities that are ever prominent in the Āpisampradāyas.

Okay, so this hucksterism, self-promotion and money -making.

These are mentioned in Vaiṣṇava Ke… Oh no, here, now he’s giving these. These are mentioned in Vaiṣṇava Ke by Śrīla Bhaktisiddhānta Sarasvatī. Anitya-vaibhava, hankering for material success. Oh no. Kāminīra-kāma, illicit sexual affairs that are usually passed off as quote-unquote transcendental.

And Māyāvāda, philosophical speculation that undercuts the personal nature of God as taught by the Vaiṣṇava Sampradāyas.

In the chapters that follow, the backgrounds of the thirteen Āpisampradāyas will be investigated, and their deviations analyzed. I have undertaken this work out of a firm belief that these thirteen cases are arch -typical of all sorts of misrepresentations of the Samkīrtana movement, of Śrī Caitanya Mahāprabhu, that have been seen down to this very day. As he declared in a lecture on July 4th, 1970, Śrīla Prabhupāda considered his only success to be the extension of Lord Caitanya’s Sampradāya into the Western world. It will be our success, as his followers, to protect the growth of ISKCON so that it may extend to every town and village of this planet, as Lord Caitanya predicted. Let us heed the warning from another prediction made by Lord Caitanya regarding the rise of Āpisampradāyas.

Viṣva-anda-kāra-kauri-ve, in my name they will make the whole world dark.

So here is that the author has put together this, that, showing, you know, what they are, how they came to the position they’re in. Because these kind of misrepresentations, he’s saying, these are arch-typical, that these thirteen kinds, these are the kinds of deviations that can come up in, you know, in Vaiṣṇava Sampradāya, specifically the Gauḍīya Sampradāya. And so he’s pointing out is that since it is predominance of material desire, right, over the desire for pure devotional service, then even for those who are properly practicing, one might see this tendency, right? But by proper association in practice, then that will be purified and go away. But if one doesn’t have the proper association in practice, then they can deviate one completely from the process. Does that make sense? So therefore, the analyzation will be for what is outside, but its application is that, you know, everybody sees that I’m not making that same kind of mistake. Because what he’s showing, why he says the history, because it shows just what path they went down, and therefore they ended up where they did. Does that make sense?

Yes. Yes. Yes, the sukṛtis can be uprooted.

That’s the point of the first offense to the Holy Name. That’s why it’s considered the worst. Others aren’t good. And let’s say the eighth offense, that’s considered… Yeah. Eighth offense… No, the seventh offense is considered… What do you call it? The most abominable. It means it’s the most disgusting, but it’s not the worst. You understand? The worst is that offending the Vaiṣṇavas, the preachers, because that then can uproot the sukṛti. So that’s why it’s the worst. The other ones will just block it. And abominable means it’ll really block it.

So that’s why one is very careful about it.

So now…

The last page was eight. Oh, I see, two. Okay. Yeah, I was thinking it should have been the introduction.

Because then we…

How did this work? Okay. One is the introduction. Two is jada-gosāi, though they’re the first of the group. Okay, yeah, otherwise it gets confusing.

So two. Jada-gosāi, caste gosāis. Jada means material.

Jada-jagat means the material world, right? Because you also have the transcendental jagat, right?

Okay, here is a quote.

So there are thirteen pseudo-pretenders belonging to the Caitanya-sampradāya.

So if I describe these thirteen, it will take thirteen hours. So I don’t describe them all. But one or two must be described. The most important is the jada-gosāi. They created a caste of goswamis, just like they created a caste of brāhmaṇas. So this goswami will come by hereditary birth, just like brāhmaṇa. So my guru Mahārāja’s contribution is that he defeated these caste goswamis, the same way as Caitanya Mahāprabhu did that. As Caitanya Mahāprabhu said, kibha-vipraḥ śūdra-nyāsa kebi-nyāya ye kṛṣṇa-tattva-veta-se guru hoye. There is no consideration whether a man is a sannyāsī, a brāhmaṇa, or a śūdra, or a gṛhastha, or a householder. Or, no. Anybody who knows the science of Kṛṣṇa, he is all right. He is goswami. He is brāhmaṇa. That is the contribution. Say, within a hundred years, that is the contribution. And for this reason, he had to face so many vehement protests from this brāhmaṇa class goswamis. They conspired to kill him. Guru Mahārāja told me personally, because by His grace, when I used to meet alone, He used to talk so many things. He was so kind that He used to talk with me. So He personally told me, quote, These people, they wanted to kill me. They collected twenty-five thousand rupees and went to the police officer in charge of that area. That, quote, You take this twenty-five thousand rupees. We shall do something against Bhaktisiddhānta Sarasvatī. You don’t take any step. End quote. And the police officer refused and came to my guru Mahārāja that, quote, You take care. This is the position. End quote. Śrīla Prabhupāda, lecture, 7th February, 1969.

The following quotations from Śrīla Rūpa Gosvāmī define the qualifications of a bona fide spiritual master who is sometimes addressed as goswāmi, gosāi, gosāni or gosāi, in the Brahma-madhya-gauḍīya-sampradāya.

Quote, One who engages in the transcendental service of the Lord in body, mind and words is to be considered and liberated in all conditions of material existence. Bhakti-rasāmṛta-sindhu, 1-2-187. End quote. One who can control the urge to speak, the mind, anger and the tongue, belly and genitals is able to accept disciples from all over the world.

Śrī Upadeśa Amṛta, 1.

The scriptures give clear warnings to those who would accept the post of guru without qualification. Quote, Never accept the post of an initiating spiritual master or temple priest as a profession. Never eat what is not offered and never offer what is not recommended in the scriptures. Nārada Pañcarātra.

Second quote. Even the slightest disreputable activity destroys a great quantity of virtue. Vast learning is destroyed just by the slightest wrong understanding.

Bhakti is destroyed by the slightest dependence upon the demigods. Nārada Pañcarātra. So, the point he got is that even a small amount, it’s not, oh, it’s just a little thing, it doesn’t matter. No, it’s just, you know, it’s just like, you have to be very careful. Just like the disease comes of a very, very small living entity. Right? You know, it says, you know, I’m so big, it’s so small. What’s the, you know, no. What he’s pointing out is one has to be very, very careful. So, in other words, improper activity can destroy a great quantity of proper activity. Right? Means here is virtue. Right? Means the devotion in which one has done something won’t be lost, but the good qualities gained might be.

Does that make sense?

Vast learning is destroyed by the slightest wrong understanding. You have a wrong understanding in one place, then you apply that wrong understanding everywhere else, so that you’ll end up with a wrong conclusion. So, all that, that good knowledge will be wasted.

Right? And then devotion is destroyed by slightest dependency on the demigods, because as soon as you’re dependent on the demigods, then you’re not dependent on Krishna, then how will it be bhakti?

Arjuna, he got beaten by those dacoits? Hasn’t he lost his effulgence?

No, that there is just the effulgence is less because Krishna’s left. Right. He’s feeling bad, but at least he was thinking, I can do this service for Krishna. Right. You know, so then some of that kshatriya spirit is there. But then he’s defeated by a bunch of cowherds. Right? Here is the man who defeated every great general on the battlefield of Kurukshetra, you know, with the prowess of his arms and his Gandiva bow. Here is a bunch of cowherds with sticks, and his Gandiva can’t do anything, he can do nothing about it. Of course, these cowherds were Krishna, you know, because otherwise his internal potency can’t be touched by the external potency. So therefore, for all these queens to be touched by these cowherds, it had to be Krishna. But still, you know, it’s a kind of wild way to, you know, end the pastime.

So the queen, he’s just protecting these ladies, right? He’s protecting a whole army, but he can’t protect a group of ladies. Right? And that, you know, he can protect against warriors, but he can’t against some cowherds with sticks. So naturally then, he’s not effulgent. But that effulgence is not meaning he’s lost his good qualities. It means he’s lost that drive, you know.

So we see after that, then the Pandavas then retired and went to the forest. Right here.

Then, next quote.

One who cannot deliver his dependents from the path of repeated birth and death should never become a spiritual master, a father, a husband, a mother, or a worshipable demigod. Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam 5.5.118 In other words, you’re connected to the bona fide spiritual master and following those instructions and trying to give those to one’s dependents. Then it works. But if that’s not what’s going on, technically one’s not qualified. Right? You can say, no, but so many people in the world and they’re… Here we’re specifically dealing with spiritual master. Right? That’s why we’re using this quote. But, you know, fathers, husbands, mothers, demigods, I mean, so many are doing. But the point is, is what are they producing? Right? Animals. But human life is meant for spiritual life. So, they’re unable to give that.

So, pointed out is that since you can’t deliver them from the process of birth and death, then just being born into the caste Goswami family doesn’t automatically make you a spiritual master. But according to their tradition, yapa-saṁsiddhāya, you automatically are.

I remember one of the caste Goswamis, he was discussing about how he’s going to, you know, go visit, you know, one of the major cities in India, where they have so many, he has so many disciples. But he was taking his son with him, because now his son is becoming big and something studied, and he’s, you know, learning how to speak and present and all that. But he wants to take his son along with him, because the point is, is he’s already initiated all the parents, but now their children are growing up, so now his son will become his disciples’ children’s guru. So, he wanted to take him to expose him, so that his own disciples would be, you know, how you say, confident that now their, that the tradition could go on, as their children can take initiation from his son now. And so then their, their, you know, their apasampradaya will go on undisturbed, like that. Does that make sense? So it’s just, so it’s automatic, because he’s born in the family, therefore automatically he’s a spiritual master. You know, it’s just like, you know, you’re born in a business family, so when you grow up and mature a little bit, then you start taking part in the business. Like that, you know, so it’s just, you know, but that’s the point, it’s a family business. So he says one shouldn’t be doing this as an occupation.

Right? One is never, that that is his occupation, he’s doing it for money. That’s why the Brahmins do the activities they do, is it’s dependent upon dakshin. Right? A ksatriya does his work, how does he get his money? Taxes. Is it an option? No. Right? Vaisya, how does he get his money? Business. Business. So is it an option whether you pay or not? No. You understand? But for the Brahmin, it’s basically an option. You know, you should give something, but it’s according to your means. Let’s say the rich man walks into the store and he wants to buy something, or the poor man walks into the store. What’s the price? Same. It’s the same. You understand? You know, let’s say you have a house, and there’s a tax on the house. It doesn’t matter if you’re rich or poor, the tax is the same. But with the Brahmin, the dakshin, you’re rich, you give more. You’re poor, you give less. You understand? So that’s why that function is on that, that’s why they do those activities. Because generally speaking, you know, it’s never, rarely given its value.

Right? Now, can you not value a kshatriya? No. No. They’re not going to tolerate it. Right? Does that make sense? So, they’ll let you know. And the businessman, if he’s well situated, he’ll let you know. And if he’s not, he’ll get you behind your back. He has lots of contacts.

You understand? But the Brahmin, even if you don’t deal properly, then, you know, he just goes on.

Does that make sense? So, here is that, it’s not an occupation. Here it’s taken as an occupation.

So, that’s the caste goswami.

Okay? So, we’ll end here. We’ll continue on Monday.

Om Hare Krishna Hare Krishna Krishna Krishna Hare Hare Hare Rama Hare Rama Rama Rama Hare Hare Shila Prabhupada Ki Shama Veda Bhakti Vrindiki Jai Nityai Govardhan It’s man by the dependence on demigods which can destroy the whole devotion to… Because, you know, I just remember one instance from Mahabharata when Krishna told Arjuna about our Gita. After that, he said, pray to Durga for victory. Yeah, well, that’s just because their Kshatriya isn’t following that culture. The point is, it’s Krishna’s call, so, therefore, but who is Durga?

Lecture Notes

A brief summary of the lecture contents, based on the notes of Śāstra-cakṣus students

  • Incorrigible offender places great emphasis on their own mundane knowledge, techniques, achievements, but due to their offenses they separate themselves from the Sampradāya.
  • Even though they base their activities on some quotes from scriptures, they accept only those parts that seem to support their point of view.
  • There is difference between having difficulties, but endeavoring to continue the proper process, and thinking that those difficulties are actually qualifications.
  • It’s not uncommon that after leaving true devotional service one invents one own process and is able to maintain that. That’s how apasampradāyas arise. One does not come back, since one believes that one’s wrongs are actually qualifications.
  • Greatness of volume of people is not necessarily a success. It’s a matter of how many people have actually taken up pure devotional service.
  • Those who are not actually spiritualists, but want to present themselves as such are very attracted to the apasampradāyas.
  • In creating an apasampradāya one goes from bona fide neophyte to a bogus madhyama – one becomes fixed in improperness.
  • Neophytes with material desires may easily become distracted by the apasampradāyas, since they present material desires in the guise of devotion.
  • The leaders of apasampradāyas usually attract people by their material qualifications.
  • Some are innocent, but due to sins in their heart they cannot firmly take shelter of a genuine sādhu-saṅga.
  • In apasampradāyas one can immediately feel taste, because that taste is material. One can immediately think one is advanced.
  • Apasampradāyas have interest in the concept of Kṛṣṇa consciousness, but not in how it is actually practiced, so they create their own process.
  • In apasampradāyas, the growing anarthas are accepted as the bhakti-latā-bīja, so the process appears very easy.
  • Sincere person comes in contact with a bonafide spiritual master. Insincere – with the acikitsa-nāmāparādhī.
  • Unless one endeavors to satisfy the spiritual master, one may receive the seed or karma, jñāna or yoga instead of the seed of devotional service.
  • One may read the Vedic literature on one’s own, but unless there are purports of a Paramahaṁsa Vaiṣṇava and association of other Vaiṣṇavas to help us understand, we will not be able to interpret the Vedic verses properly.
  • Saṅga is devotee association, Sangha is the institution for devotee association.
  • Institution is there to create association of devotees. If there is some difficulty, we should still try to be Kṛṣṇa conscious on our own, maintaining that interest of association with devotees, but Kṛṣṇa consciousness is always much stronger in the association of devotees.
  • The 13 apasampradāyas are archetypical of deviant mentalities that might come up. Even in those who are properly practicing these tendencies might come up.
  • 51:20 Jāta-gosāñi
  • Even the slightest disreputable activity destroys a great quantity of virtue. Vast learning is destroyed by the slightest wrong understanding. Bhakti is destroyed by the slightest dependence on the demigods.
  • One must be able to deliver the dependents from the cycle of birth and death. Simple birth in a caste goswami family does not guarantee this ability. However, they consider that it is automatic.
  • One should not become a spiritual master as an occupation. Brāhmana is not an occupation in the sense that if people do not give so much money, brāhmana still continues his activities.

Sign In

Register

Reset Password

Please enter your username or email address, you will receive a link to create a new password via email.