So the observable, even the experience, goes back to Sambandha, because it becomes part of the field. The man works hard, gets money, so now that money was his goal from the work. But once he has money, now that’s part of the field, that’s part of the Sambandha, so he has money. So now, the money, now he wants to buy a house, so the house is the goal, but once he’s bought the house, the house becomes part of the field, right? So prayojana always goes back into Sambandha. So we are servants of Kṛṣṇa, that’s Sambandha. Yes. We serve Kṛṣṇa, that’s Abhidhaya. Yes. And that gives more service to Kṛṣṇa. It gives more service, but the point is the prayojana is Kṛṣṇa’s happiness. Yes. So giving more to the prayojana, that would be correct to say the prayojana would be more service. No, no, no. Means, that goes back to it, the result will be more service, but that service comes from, that is part of Sambandha, so now your field for service has expanded, that’s why you can do more. You can’t do something if the facility is not there. Does that make sense? You know, if you have a small room, you can only put so much in it. The room is bigger, you can put more in it, right? You know what I’m saying? So therefore you have a big house, so you plan a program. You have a small house, you plan a program. Does that make sense? Like that.
But the point is, is that the prayojana has effect on the Sambandha, because it increases it. Does that make sense? You know, you have the element that the feminine nature is in that position of prayojana, right?
Does that make sense? Because that’s where the, you know, the feelings, the goals, all those different things are there, the attachment, all that. The masculine being the field, and then being, you know, the proper mood, you know, has to be there, the proper knowledge, like that. It’s not that there’s need of proper mood or proper knowledge in the prayojana, right? That’s dependent upon your Sambandha jnana, right? If you have the proper understanding and properly applied, then what will you get? A proper or improper result? Proper result. So that means that’s not where, if there’s something that you see is wrong in the mood or that in the prayojana.
Does that make sense? In the feminine, that’s because in the Sambandha something’s wrong, because it’s only a response, right? In other words, if you look in the mirror and there’s a black spot on the face of the mirror. Yeah, then you can understand it’s on your own face. That’s why it’s reflected like that. Does that make sense? It’s a science, but we want to deal with it emotionally. No, it should be like this. No, like that. So therefore, and now in that, what is one of the Sanskrit names for the wife?
Stree. Stree, in this connection, right? Stree means to expand, because prayojana, when you get it, that makes the field bigger.
You understand? So by interacting with the feminine, it means automatically it expands. That’s why you see the spiritual always expanding, because Krsna is interacting with His internal potency. So therefore, it’s always expanding.
Does that make sense? Maya, it’s always expanding. It’s feminine. You don’t interact, nothing expands.
You understand? So it’s all consistent. That’s what I was saying. You know the philosophy, you know the culture. You know, we’ll be saying that it’s always a different thing. Like, you know, the other day, was it here or was it in the class? A discussion about, OK, if we want to establish the culture, then, oh, it was after the class.
Establish the culture, then how do we do that when the Western, you know, we’re so used to the Western culture. No, that’s not Western. That’s like saying, you know, an empty refrigerator, you don’t call food.
You know, or you don’t call that, you know, what would be a larder. There’s other terms meaning, you know, your stock, stock of food. Now, if that place where food’s kept is empty, you say you have a stock of food. No. So therefore, you can’t call it Western culture because there’s an absence of. All that is that some of them are more refined at their lack of culture. That’s all. You know what I’m saying? You know, it’s like that. You could say it’s setting the standard on how to deal when you don’t have any culture in a very sophisticated way. You know, then that, you know, the French, they set the set the standard, you know, like that. Yeah, that’s the benchmark. You know how to how to even though you have no culture, then present it as if you really do. You know, like that. So they’re the best at it. We have the same culture.
We don’t have too much. We spread it.
That’s good. They think about these things. That doesn’t come from not thinking. Yeah. No, they’re very, very thoughtful.
Yeah, I’m sure it is. Very, very nice. That’s it. Makes it more. You spread it more. Yeah.
So. So the point is, is you have the philosophy. If you actually understand, you have the culture. But it’s the knowledge. You have to apply it. But the application is not different from the knowledge. All you’re doing is applying what you know. Right. That may take practice to get it where what you know and what you can do is the same. And therefore, you know, it will also affect the priogeny, the result. You know, the better the closer your action is to your knowledge, then the closer the result will be to, you know, what’s expected.
Does that make sense? You know, like that. So it’s not a separate endeavor. That’s right. The culture of Krishna consciousness is based on having the knowledge like we see in Nectar of Devotion. In the sixth chapter where he lists Sadhana Bhakti, he’s taking that full list from the Hari Bhakti Vilas, which is defining Sambandha.
Right. But he’s just showing what’s the proper mood, the proper attitude. You know, and how and then technically how that would be applied, the art of application. You know, but it’s it’s a it’s a science, you know, saying because it’s exact, it’s always the same. It’s not it’s not speculative.
When the living entity’s relationship with the Lord is revived by the association of Amnaya, then Abhidheya is understood. Because if you have the one, the next is automatically there. Devotional service to Sri Krsna is that Abhidheya. The purport is that whatever the scripture specifies, one’s prime duty is called Abhidheya. In this regard, Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu says in the Caitanya-caritamrta, Madhya-lila 22.17-18, devotional service to Krsna is the chief function of the living entity. There are different methods for the liberation of the conditioned soul, karma, jnana, yoga and bhakti. But all are dependent on bhakti. But for devotional service, all other methods for spiritual self-realization are weak and insignificant. Unless one comes to the devotional service of Lord Krsna, jnana and yoga cannot give the desired results. Right. So here in here, then yoga would include karma because yoga is part of the karma. So you can either say, generally they’ll say jnana and karma, which includes yoga. But here they’ve said yoga to make sure that’s there. But that includes karma because yoga means activity, you know, like that. Does that mean that the Germans are engaged in yoga when they make pretzels?
Because yoga is like you’re putting yourself like a pretzel.
Oh. So then they’re making, is that part of the yoga process? I have some German godbrothers. I have to ask them. Yeah. We haven’t been discussing that exactly. Yeah, you should ask. Could be. You know, because the standard pretzel is in the form of a lotus position, right? So it’s like that. Yeah, you should ask. Actually, it’s only half lotus, isn’t it? No, no, both sides.
OK. Sadhana-bhakti is called abhidheya. That sadhana-bhakti is divided into two, vaidi and raganuga. Vaidi sadhana-bhakti is of many varieties. Now it says, it’s called sadhana-bhakti is abhidheya, right? Now sadhana-bhakti is sadhana-bhakti. So vaidi and raga, it’s the mood, it’s not the form. Many times there’s a mistake made that the form changes with raganuga. They like to make it that way. But that means then they’re making it into a rule. So someone who says that raga will be a different form means they don’t know what raga is. And what they’re actually describing is vaidi. But instead of it being the standard of what dhammaya is giving, it’ll be more whimsical. It’ll have that whimsical element. So we should be very careful. Spontaneous doesn’t mean whimsical. Spontaneous means you’re very comfortable with the field and you can work within it in an inspired way. Well, vaidi means you just do it because this is what has to be done. Right? Does that make sense? So you become good enough at the science of it that one can deal in a natural way. Whatever you feel like doing, that you can do. But it’s still within the framework of sadhana. It never leaves that framework. Right?
In some places, sixty-four limbs are given. And in some places, nine limbs are given. Right? So nine is the basic fundamental.
And then from there you can describe everything. Or you can take sixty-four and that will include the nine. Like that. So it’s just which you want to start with. When a conditioned living entity engages his mind at the lotus feet of Krsna with his mind, with his mind, body and words, that is called bhakti. The differences in bhakti from karma and jnana are very subtle. Many times the limbs of bhakti and karma appear similar. When those limbs are connected with separate desires, they turn into limbs of karma. When those limbs are connected with dry thoughts of Brahman, they turn into limbs of jnana. In some limbs there is neither karma or jnana involved. The fruits of karma that lead one to the service of Krsna alone are called limbs of bhakti.
The limbs of karma that lead one to his own enjoyment is called karma. The karma that leads one to merge with the Lord is called impersonal jnana.
So he’s pointing out that the activity is the same.
But the point is, what’s it doing? The result of it, that’s what makes it a limb of one of these or the other. That you’re performing activities, then we’ll say it’s part of the karma. But because it’s connected to the Lord, then it’s karma yoga or bhakti. If we’re understanding the philosophy and understanding the eternal aspect of the Lord, then that will be jnana yoga. We’re seeing Brahman, we’re seeing Paramatma, we’re seeing it. By the philosophy we’re seeing everything. Then that’s jnana yoga. But now if you’re seeing it and the result is impersonal Brahman, then it’s just jnana. Or the activity, its result is fruit and then it’s just karma.
Therefore, Srila Rupa Gosvami is given the symptoms of bhakti in the Bhakti-rasamrta-sindhu, 119, as follows. One should render transcendental loving service to the Supreme Lord, Krsna, favorably and without desire for material profit or gain through fruit of activities or philosophical speculation. That is called pure devotion. So the service is favorable to Krsna. Otherwise, it’s connected to Krsna, that’s a start. But it’s mixed.
If it’s favorable to Krsna, it means there is no karma-jnana. So if there is some karma-jnana, how much mix of karma-jnana is there? It’s how much it’s not favorable to Krsna.
Favorable to Krsna but not realized. Yes, then you’d say the mentality. So the activity may be, but then it’s also getting… So that’s why all are mentioned, because they all will be together, but also they can be separately analyzed.
You know what I’m saying? Like, let’s say, you’re cooking for Krsna. You’re cooking, following everything very nicely, all that. So you could say it’s favorable to Krsna, but you want to get recognized to be such a good cook. So then it’s mixed with some karma, like that. So you’re always going to have… Or it’s being done, you’re doing for Krsna and everything, but what you’re cooking is not necessarily favorable. You know what I’m saying? We won’t get into details. It’s a big, big topic. Very emotional topic.
Like that.
To perform the limbs of devotional service according to the dictation of vaidhi or prescribed rules is called vaidhi-sadhana-bhakti.
The service performed out of spontaneous attachment to Krsna is called raga-bhakti. Right here, service according to the dictation of vaidhi. It’s not, it didn’t say according to vaidhi. It’s the dictation. Right? Following the prescribed rules is not the problem. The point is, is that you’re following because that’s what you’re supposed to do. That’s what makes it vaidhi. Right? So one can see is that actually the person on spontaneous devotional service can only be spontaneous because he’s actually very expert at vaidhi. So this concept that we’ll just bypass vaidhi and go straight doesn’t, you know what I’m saying? It’s just like saying is, I don’t know how to ride a bicycle. So instead of just riding in the normal way like everybody else, I’m just going to straight get on the bicycle and, you know, do all the tricks and all that that they do in the circus.
No, the guy, does that make sense? Yeah, it won’t work. I remember my father once was saying about these guys who are actually professional car racers. You know, the Formula, the Le Mans, all these different kinds of things. When they get in their family, one is they have a family car. You know, they don’t have this, you know, hot rod kind of thing like that. No, because that they have on the track. They get into a family car. It looks like any other car. And they drive it very, very carefully and all that. Why? Because they know how dangerous it is. So the thing is, is that. But the point is, is they’re very expert. And I’m saying so the point they know the rules very well, but they know them so well, they become second nature. That now, instead of focusing on the rules, you’re focusing on the emotion, the exchange.
Does that make sense? That’s what’s happening. But someone can stay invited because they like the formality of the rules, you know. But even within them, they will talk about that more natural and spontaneous, though it’s within with invited. So sometimes you see the Sri’s talk about that, but they’re not leaving. They’re not talking about they’re talking about that. The more you become so good at it, it becomes naturally. But they will stay within the form of the rules. That’s that’s the mood. So it stays formal. What we’re talking about is that the rules have followed, but it’s not coming because the rule is the medium for expression. It’s just that that’s how things get done properly. Right. If I put the spoon in the pot and stir, then the preparation doesn’t burn. You can say that’s a rule. So I’m spontaneous. I’ll do whatever I want. Leave the spoon in the drawer. You know, throw it around, you know, like that. You know, whack the outside of the pot with it like that. Or, you know, you know, I’m saying, you know, I stick it underneath, get it hot a little bit, you know. So I said, no, but that’s whimsical.
The point is, is somebody’s thinking about stirring. The person is very expert. Doesn’t he just gets the spoon and just stirs? And he just always is sticking or not.
You know what I’m saying? So that makes sense.
So, yeah.
So that’s the fundamental. That in doing that, getting the mood of it, that it may also function outside of the rule. That’s that’s a detail.
The principle is that it’s working within the element. You know, it’s just like the when Lord Sanatana Goswami first saw Madana Mohana. He was in the family of a one Brahman family in Mathura like that. And so he’s there and they’re they’re worshiping. And he’s just part of the family. It’s just like they have so many kids. So he’s another one of the kids. So, you know, he likes sweet rice and that. So the mother of the family cooks sweet rice. So once you put it on and all that, she went to brush your teeth. But then it started to burn. Right. So you’re using these neem twigs. You know, you you take the twig and you chew on it very carefully at the end and it frays. So it becomes wide like that, you know. And so then, you know, you brush your teeth with that. So then she’s going and then it starts to stick. So she just immediately comes in and starts to stir it. Right. But using the neem twig. Right. Because the spoon is in your hand. It’s long and it’s got a wide end. You know, so this does that. You know, she stirred it. So she’s just thinking it can’t stick. So that’s done by stirring. That’s done like that. So it’s beyond the rules, but it’s not against the technique. You understand?
So Raghunuga will never leave the technique, though it may not use the standard detail.
Does that make sense? Where was this example from?
Madame Mohan.
Like that.
So then, you know, Sanatana Goswami, he complained about that. You know, and then, oh, they’re feeling, oh, OK, that’s bad. I should be very careful, you know. But, you know, but because it would ruin the mood like that. So I think I think Madame Mohan may have chastised him for that. But then when he went back the next day to apologize, because the point is, is this the mood? So there was nothing wrong with it.
But then then he went to apologize. So Madame Mohan came in a dream to him and chastised him for that. But he also came in a dream to the Brahman and said when Sanatana Goswami comes the next day, you should give me to him. Like that.
Does that make sense? So the rule is only there because of the efficiency of the form. So the efficiency of the form was there. Because the point of consideration was the milk sticking, how to see that it doesn’t stick. So you stir it. Right. If it just been a stick, it wouldn’t work. But because it had been chewed on and it has the white, then it would work. You understand. So technically it worked. Consideration is, is, you know, you don’t generally use, you know, what you brush your teeth with. You stir the sweet rice for the Lord. That’s the general point. So the standard of purity and all those different things. So and there it goes against that. But the point is, is the principle was the milk was sticking.
Does that make sense?
What we’re trying to establish is that Raghunuga sadhana is still sadhana. So it’ll be based on the 64 items of devotional service. So the nine items. It doesn’t change that. If it changes that, then it’s, you know, it’s not Raghunuga sadhana.
Because the principle remains. But the detail may change.
To perform the limbs of devotional service according to the dictation of vidhi or prescribed rules is called vaidhi sadhana, bhakti. The service performed out of spontaneous attachment to Krsna is called Raghunuga sadhana. It means you have the attachment. That’s why you do the service. The other thing is you, you want to run the service. So you follow the rules. The rules then get you to the attachment. The other way, you start with the attachment. Then you apply the rule. But the rules, I mean, the activities remains the same. The devotion of the Vrajavasis is called Raghatmika. And imitation of their devotional service is called Raghunuga.
Vaidhi, bhakti starts from sraddha and proceeds up. Let’s go with that. So this Raghatmika, so that’s, this is the general definition. Is that Raghatmika means, Ragh is the life.
Raghatmika, right? Means the life is Ragha. Ragh is the life of it. Right? So, but we’re Raghanuga. We’re following in the footsteps of Ragh. Right? So Raghunuga then means that one is not on that platform. One’s trying to obtain that platform. So therefore, Raghun, therefore it’s called Raghunuga sadhana. Right? Once one comes to prema, then by this step, one will be Raghatmika. Because that, that makes sense? But one must remember, always within the definition of Raghatmika, there are those that are actually the, the ones that are establishing the Ragh and those who are following in their footsteps or assisting them. Does that make sense? So mother, just technically you could say, she’s Raghatmika and all the other elder gopis and gopas, they’re Raghanuga of her Raghatmika bhakti. But that Raghanuga is not sadhana. That’s on the, you know, that’s on the natural platform, prema. Does that make sense? So it’s very important that it is defined this way, but you want to make sure you’re careful, because otherwise then the element, the element that I become a great devotee or I become, no, we’re always servant, the element of Raghanuga, we’re always going to be following. One is that Raghanuga, we’re only imitating it. The other is not we’re imitating, we’re assisting in it. So, does that make sense? So you could say then, or you say that the Raghanuga has two forms. The, the, where you’re, you’re copying it because that’s the proper thing to do. Right? You know, the expert does something and you try to do that to imitate. The other is that you’re, you’re expert at it also, but your expertise is only assisting the original person’s expertise.
Does that make sense?
Vaidehi-bhakti starts from sraddha and proceeds up to rati, when it becomes one with Raghanuga -bhakti. Raghanuga-bhakti is always forceful. This is the ninth principle. Right? So the abhidheya is the, is the, the, the ninth that is given. But in here he’s, he’s bringing it out that this Raghanuga being dynamic, that’s what we’re actually talking about.
Does that, does that make sense? You know, all the other things are to get us to that platform. Yes.
I would think so. Because otherwise if it’s static, it’s not creating any force. Like that.
Oh, so then actually when they’re talking about the force being with you, you’re talking about that the actual, natural Raghanuga platform of devotion is, is, is your position here.
I didn’t know they were not advanced enough.
What to do? According, OK, so that’s the ninth principle, right? So we’re establishing what is the higher element there, right? According to the statements of Amnaya, the tenth principle is that prema is the prayojana or supreme goal, right? So here we’re giving these, these, these, these elements because on the spiritual platform you don’t need to know Krishna’s God, right? The Vrajabhasis, he can be God or not. What he does in his spare time, that’s up to him, right? But, but that’s not what’s important to them, right? That they’re jivas and that you’re cintabha. This is not what’s important. So this is all for coming to that perfect platform of prema. Therefore, here then, then the, the, the abhidheya means that you’re on the platform of bhava because that’s where then it’s dynamic, force, you know, like that. Because you’re in the direct association of the eternal associates. You understand that prema is there. There is no conditioning, right? But, so it’s now, it’s just a matter of converting, converting from a neutral state to prema. Does that make sense? Like that. So then you can say it’s, that’s actually the, the, you could say the, the, you know, the full manifestation of abhidheya in the process.
Yes. Neutral.
Neutral. It means you have material, you have spiritual, and then you have devotional. Right? So spiritual is a neutral state. Right? Like that. Does that make sense? Because before that, then one’s dealing with the anarthas, removing all those different aspects like that. Does that make sense? So you would say that that’s not the full manifestation.
Right? Bhava would be the full manifestation of this abhidheya that’s being described. Right? And then now prayojana, that will be the tenth principle. Because you’re trying to get that. Right? That’s why also then before is that ruci and asakti would be counted as the preliminaries of bhava because then it’s starting to, that spontaneity is coming up. When you have a taste, it becomes spontaneous. Right? We’ll chant our rounds because we’re supposed to chant sixteen rounds. Right? That’s why we chant. Right? Some days we may like, some days we may not like. But what drives us to chant is that we’re supposed to. That’s vaidhi. And when you get a taste, when ruci is there, you chant because you like to. Right? You’re still going to chant your sixteen rounds. Right? Still in the same way. You have beads and, you know, in the bead bag and, you know, the same thing. Right? It’s not that then when you get to taste or like that then, you know, you put the bead bag the other way or something like that or put it on the other hand or don’t use the bead bag or… Does that make sense? It stays there. So, it could be said that you are only Raganuga Bhakti when you already have a choir like Mr. Ruchi or Saki or they are independent? Yes. Means that’s where… That will be… Means… You can say that’s the preliminary… That can be the preliminary stage of Raganuga sadhana. Right? So… But the point is, it doesn’t necessarily have to be at that time. Because he’s mentioned here. Vaidehi starts from sraddha and proceeds up to rati. Right? When it becomes one with Raganuga Bhakti. So, that means bhava is Raganuga because there is no… For us. I mean, someone on the Vaikuntha platform, it’s always Vaidehi, so there’s no question of that. But it will have that more natural development.
You know? So, it would be… I’m sure that they… I’m not sure what term they use, but they would probably have a… They have a term for that. You know? But… But the point is this. Raga can start from nistha, but that’s only because of anartha-nivritti. See, bhava, you can say, anartha-nivritti is complete because there is no conditioned nature. Right? That’s the point. So, there it becomes one with. Before that, then you have the mood and you have the form of it, but at this point it becomes with.
But it also has the element, even if it’s there, if Raganuga is the beginning with nistha, still Vaidehi Bhakti proceeds up to Rati. So, the form that one will see will be Vaidehi. It won’t change like that.
According to the statements of Amnaya, the tenth principle is that prema is the prayojana or supreme goal. Those who have doubts in these ten principle teachings of Sri Caitanya Mahaprabhu are not qualified for devotional service. When doubts arise, one’s devotional service becomes corrupted. Desires are polluted. Unwanted results are achieved, and thus everything is ruined. Right? So, the point is this. Devotional… Okay. Are not qualified for devotional service because you’re supposed to qualify devotional service as we’ve seen defined here is Raganuga platform of bhava. So, one’s not going to get to that position if one has doubts. Right? So, that’s why the doubts have to be removed before that. Right?
Otherwise, then it says, services corrupted, desires polluted, unwanted results are achieved. Right? So, then one will get distracted. Because the doubt will distract one. You know? And we see is that if there’s doubt, sraddha is not strong. When he’s defining sraddha, sraddha also meant without doubt. And when the person takes up devotional process, he has no doubts. You know, that the new person, the Krsna, has no doubts. He says, this is it. This is the greatest. Even the slight little things, it doesn’t compare to the difficulties that are there in material life. Because the proximity is close, the comparison you can see. But when one’s been for a long time not involved in material life, the proximity is not so great. So, now the problems within the devotional seem to be so great. Yeah, but they’re not. You know? Does that make sense? You know, it’s like, you know, the little girl is skipping along and, you know, when she goes by the fence, there’s a splinter there, and it catches the corner of a dress and it, you know, makes a little hole there. And so this is a big thing, you know, the favorite dress. She’s really, really feeling bad. Right? And she’s telling, you know, some other person that. And they say, that’s nothing. You know, I was skipping along and then the Nazis rolled in and then things like that shot my whole family. And I had to run. And, you know, not only did, you know, a little hole, you know, my dress got half ripped off to escape. Like that. You know, then it’s kind of a comparison. OK, it’s not so bad. It’s not so bad. We’re doing OK. You understand? So that’s the thing is we forget. And then because of that, then it becomes very big. So then what happens? Doubts come up. Faith is not so strong. If faith’s not so strong, Sadhusangha is not so strong. Right? The person with doubts does not associate with devotees very seriously.
Their bhajana kriya is not so strong.
You know what I’m saying? That’s why doubts are dangerous. So even, but, so someone may have advanced. It doesn’t mean that you’re put back at the beginning and you’re no different than the new person. It just means that as long as that doubt’s there, you may be functioning only on that platform. But as soon as you remove the doubt, you’ll see that immediately they’re back to their position that they were in.
Does that make sense? It’s a sign of intelligence, but the point is, is the mind has to accept. You know, just because, see, that one can find something different, that doesn’t, that’s, it’s a symptom that one has intelligence, but it doesn’t necessarily mean that finding the doubt is intelligent.
You know what I’m saying? Because you can make a statement and someone who’s clever can immediately find an exception.
You know, it’s always like that. You say something and the person who has the doubt, they always come up with the, you know, most absurd exception. You know? And if you ask them, well, is there another one? There isn’t one. There’s only one.
But they’re so, in their mind, now they’ve defeated your whole point. No, it’s 99.99%. There’s that one-tenth of a percent. It’s like, yeah, but the point is, is God’s made exceptions because there’s a higher, there’s a principle above it that holds it all together. Otherwise, how would it mechanically work? Exceptions couldn’t work if there’s not some mechanics. Right? Conch shell is bone. Right? You can’t say it’s not bone. Right? So that bone, other bones are all bones. So there’s 100%. Now the point is, is that all bones are impure. Conch shell is not. So that would mean that there’s some difference in how it’s, you know, the mechanics of how that works. Right? But still, it functions as bone, looks like bone, it is bone. So the difference is only in the purity. Right? So it’s not a major thing that’s been found. Right? Does that make sense? So how that works is still God may arrange that. You know what I’m saying? Why is it the bones in the animal is one thing, the bones with, you know, the conch. It’s also an animal, but it’s pure. Why isn’t it not? Because of some other thing. So if you want to scientifically look into it, maybe there’s some chemical things or this and that. So, you know, it’s another thing. But that’s the mechanics of how it becomes like that. The point is God arranged it that way. You know what I’m saying? So it’s an exception, but God made the exception.
You know what I’m saying? It’s hard to make a conch shell out of, you know, something to blow out of grass or, you know, something else.
Does that make sense? Out of hollow bone. So that would be the thing. After blowing the conch for Arctic, then you can eat it. Now that would be good.
Academy would have to expand. Yeah. Yeah.
OK. Does that make sense? So the point is, is that the removal of doubts is very important. Doubt is there. That’s intelligence. But the doubt is easy to remove. What’s hard to remove is misgiving. Misgiving means the mind won’t accept it. Right. Doubt means the intelligence can’t connect the two. Because it doesn’t seem logical. Misgiving means you can make it as logical as you want. The mind doesn’t care. It doesn’t like it. Like, why doesn’t the kid, you know, the kid won’t eat raw tomatoes. Why not? It’s a doubt or it’s a misgiving. It’s a misgiving. So even though you explain to him it’s nice, it’s this, it’s that, it doesn’t matter.
Right. So that’s that’s more of a problem. So that has nothing to do with intelligence. So when devotees are discussing social issues and that, those are misgivings. Those aren’t doubts.
So it doesn’t matter how logical present. You’re not dealing with intelligence there. They’ll claim it is. They’ll hide behind intelligence, but it’s not intelligence. It’s simply the mind.
What’s the cost of misgiving?
Attachment. Means, in other words, what it is that you’re attached to, then the doubt is presented as a doubt because you don’t like the conclusion of the discussion. Because the discussion means I have to give up something I’m attached to. So one doesn’t like that.
Well, logic just means it didn’t make sense. You said this and you said that, you know, you used that, you know, we’re dragging to get here and you used it there. But it’s contradictory. That’s a doubt. And then as soon as you say, no, we’re defining it here like this and here like that. So. Oh, OK. It’s just intellectual. There’s no. There’s no problem.
You have a doubt.
The form is according to rules. It’s not that they are that they are on the platform of Vaidhi Bhakti. It’s that their love for Krishna is expressed through the form of rules. That’s all. It makes it formal. It’s very clear exactly how to express your love. So it’s natural.
No, you wouldn’t say like that. You wouldn’t use that term.
That’s why I say they have words for it. So you don’t need to get into it. You know, I’m saying the point is, is that that’s why I use the word natural or some other things like that, because that gives the understanding that he can ride the bike naturally. That means he doesn’t have to worry. Think about, you know, where the break is and this and that. You know what I’m saying? But we’re not emphasizing the mood. Raghunuga means that that attachment to Krishna is the driving force. So how it’s manifest is not actually of importance. You know what I’m saying? The gopis, then when they hear Krishna play the flute, they want to go out and be with him. Right now. One of the exchanges between the masculine and feminine principle is beauty. Right. Because that’s the opulence. That’s the first of opulences. Right. So that platform becomes that. So therefore, in their impatience, they go and try to make themselves more beautiful by spending a few moments. But the end result is they’ve only put cudgel on one eye or they put the sari on the top. And they put the lower cloth on the top, the top cloth on the bottom. Right. Like that. Or some of them, you know, while tying on the ankle bells, tie the cloth onto their ankle also and go running off like that, you know, because it’s like the cloth gets put on. It’s wrapped around. There’s an ankle that gets wrapped around. They go. So this is spontaneous.
The form doesn’t matter.
Does that make sense? But the Vaikuntha mood is that you’re you’re very natural in your expressing your love through the rules. So therefore, you don’t use the term spontaneous because it always has to follow the rule. Though it’s not a practice, it’s not sadhana. It’s on the platform of prema. You know what I’m saying?
In other words, words are there to express something. Don’t get attached to the particular syllables and all that that it’s using.
No, but they can use it there because they’re most because Brudge means what? What is Brudge? What’s the speciality of Brudge?
Spontaneity. But what what what what what Rasa has set a very unique form there. That’s not that other Rasa’s aren’t that different.
Yeah, like that. That’s the outstanding. When you think of Vrindavan, then you think it means it’s Radha and Krishna.
Right. Right. Not cowherd boys. Mother Deshoda, of course. But the point is, this is Radha and Krishna.
Right. So therefore, it’s brought out in that aspect. But it’s not that the cowherd boys aren’t spontaneous or the parents aren’t spontaneous.
So he said, that’s why he said here, the Brudge Vasis.
So the devotion of the Brudge Vasis is called Raghatmika. So. So there’s everybody’s on that platform of Ra.
Does that make sense? So Raghanuga is that mood that the form is not is secondary to the mood. Right. In Vaikuntha, the form is essential for expressing the mood. There is that if it works in a typical way in Vrindavan, that’s not a problem. But if it doesn’t, it’s also not a problem.
But in Vaikuntha, it must be through the rule. That’s the form.
Does that make sense? So there’s plenty of mood and feelings and all that, but the expression is through the rule.
Does that make sense?
So you wouldn’t use that word. That’s why I said they must have some something that they define that by.
Yes. Is that transition from Vaidya practice to Raghunuga automatically?
Means at what stage are you discussing?
Sadhana Bhakti.
The point is, is that there’s no one never leaves Vaidya in Sadhana Bhakti. The form is always Vaidya.
Is it the conscious decision to desire it? The only qualification is the desire for it. And some say you have to struggle. It means you desire it, but the point is that it says here that it becomes one.
It naturally merges into that. So if one hasn’t taken up Ragh before Bhava, it will happen at Bhava. Because that’s what everybody else is doing. Because you’re in Vrndavana. The Vrajavasis are Raghatmika. So you’re automatically going to take that up. If you’ve taken it up beforehand, nice. If you haven’t, it doesn’t matter.
Does that make sense? It’s not necessary once taken it up before.
It will be automatic.
Therefore, those who have a desire for pure devotional service should perform devotional service with firm confidence. Because he said firm confidence is faith. Free from doubt. Srila Prabhupada describes niscayana as follows. One should not be impatient in discharging devotional service, but should take instructions from the spiritual master and execute them with patience, depending upon the mercy of guru and Krsna. The successful execution of Krsna conscious activities requires both patience and confidence.
A newly married girl naturally expects offspring from her husband, but she cannot expect to have them immediately after marriage. Of course, as soon as she is married, she can attempt to get a child, but she must surrender to her husband. Confident that her child will develop and be born in due time. Similarly, in devotional service, surrender means that one has to become confident. The devotee thinks, avasya rakhi ve krsna. Krsna will surely protect me and give me help for the successful execution of devotional service. This is called confidence.
So that surrender to Krsna, that confidence that everything is going to work. There’s other ways to think, I’m doing it, then it’s a problem.
What would be the best way to develop this patience?
Because if the heart is more important… No, it means all are important. Giving six that are important. So the point is this, by enthusiasm, but that comes by association. It’s through association that everything works very nicely. What’s that? It means by association one will gain patience, by association one will gain enthusiasm. Like that. So that’s why association with devotees is very important.
It’s best to have a long life. Means long life can be useful for that, you know. But it doesn’t mean that one can’t work it out early also, as we see Narada Muni in his birth as a maidservant, by six he is already self-realized, and Pallad Maharaj at five.
Like that. But if one is a little slower than them, then long life has its advantages for that. That’s the only advantage. Otherwise then it’s just a longer time in an unfortunate situation.
We’ll have to take a momentary break.
Thank you.
Hello.
Very good.
Very good. Yes.
Madam.
Yes. Well, this is what we are studying, so… Yeah. Yeah.
Thank you. All right. All right.
I will have to speak with Mr. Raj.
Of course there is Maharaj.
All right.
All right. He cut down.
All right. Very good. Okay, so what’s your question?
All right.
All right.
I have a question about the confidence.
Can we… What I understood about confidence is there is a link with determination. A link with determination.
Because it was said, endeavoring with confidence. So to endeavor means…
Well, it means you’re endeavoring with intelligence. That would be your confidence. So the point is that you’ll make an endeavor when there’s no doubt. So if there’s doubt, then that… Yeah, you can’t make the endeavor because the confidence is not there. Like that. So the process, we use the intelligence, understand everything, whatever we don’t understand, we clear that. Then we’ll have that confidence. Then when we make that endeavor, then it will be very fruitful.
Like that. So then that’s enthusiasm. Enthusiasm is the endeavor with intelligence. So then the confidence means there’s no doubt.
So you’re addressing that intellectual part. Because it’s identity. So intelligence is in the sambanda aspect.
So then if… Excuse me. Intelligence is in the sambanda aspect. So therefore, if the intelligence has no doubt, then the identity will have no doubt. But if there’s doubt, then that will be part of the identity. So then one will lack confidence. At least spiritually, maybe not materially.
But the point is, wherever there’s no doubt, that’s where someone… Like the gross materialist, he has no doubt that he’ll be happy by material endeavor. Therefore, he works very hard. The common person doesn’t have that confidence. That’s why they can’t work as hard materially. Because they doubt that it will actually make me happy.
Like that. That’s the thing. So the same principle is that when there’s no doubt that spiritual life is what you want, then one will have that faith. One will be able to endeavor very nicely.
Like that. Determination would be more as that you… Here it’s more as that you have no doubt and you, with intelligence, are in making an endeavor. Determination would be to continue that even though there are obstacles. Does that make sense? So it’s more of the continuity of your enthusiasm and your confidence and all that. Does that make sense? Because otherwise, they will, with time, you might be very enthusiastic and very confident, but then when you run into an obstacle, then you lose that. So to continue that, we call that determination. But it’s still the same thing. The doubt’s there, then you use the intelligence, remove the doubt, then the confidence comes, then with enthusiasm, you can perform your… Yes.
Determination, if you have doubts, you go on.
No, determination’s more as that there’s obstacles, you go on. Because if there’s a doubt, you generally don’t… aren’t functioning. You might, but you don’t lack… you lack the confidence. So there you would call that, let’s say, moral, you know, moral fiber or moral fortitude or dutiful, you know, is that you don’t actually have faith in it, but you’re doing it as you’re supposed to. So it’s a different quality.
Determination would mean is that there’s going to be obstacles, so you continue despite the obstacles. Because you have that faith. Because otherwise, there’s the ideas that I take up a religious process because that’s piety. Therefore, piety gives good results. Therefore, my religious practice should always give good results. There should be no obstacles.
Right? So then the neophyte runs into a difficulty because you’re in the material world, there’s still going to be obstacles. Because the point is, is it’s not that you’re… you’re not working on the principle that… I don’t know how you say it. The principle is not there that because you have decided to take up devotional service that everybody else has also.
Right? Does that make sense? So you’re performing your service, but others are not. So you get obstacles.
You know what I’m saying? Because what’s an obstacle? You want it to go one way, but somebody else wants it to go different.
Right? So it always comes back to the person.
Does that make sense? Or it can be that they’re… that they’re within the devotional, then it’s an artist.
Right? Or if there’s no an artist, just they have different ideas of how to serve Krishna.
Right? So that principle is always going to be there. Right? That there’s going to be something that seemingly is an obstacle to your service. That’s always going to remain. Right? Because the cowherd boys, they go out and play all day, all night, and, you know, camp out in the woods and like that. But there’s an obstacle. Mother Dashoda wants Krishna home, you know, before the sun sets. So, you know, you got to live with it. That’s just the way it is.
Does that make sense?
Number nine. Second summary of Srila Bhaktivinoda Thakura’s essay on dhairya, patience.
For the practitioner of devotional service, dhairya, patience, is extremely necessary. Those who possess the quality of dhairya are called dhira, sober. Due to lack of this quality, men become restless. Those who are impatient cannot do any work. By the quality of dhairya, the practitioner controls first himself and then the whole world. In the first verse of Sri Upadesa Mrita, the symptoms of dhairya are explained. A sober person who can tolerate the urge to speak, the mind’s demands, the actions of anger, and the urges of the tongue, belly, and genitals is qualified to make disciples all over the world.
There are six types of urges, namely the urges of speech, mind, anger, belly, tongue, and genitals. With a desire to speak more, a person becomes talkative. If speech is not regulated, then enmity arises from talking about others. To speak uselessly is the business of a fool. But out of a desire to unnecessarily engage in speech, the materialist always wastes time and faces so many distresses. Therefore, devotees should speak only on topics about Lord Hari or those favorable to such topics. All other topics will be counted in the category of the urge to speak. Because it’s always going to create a problem. If it’s about the Lord, it’s purifying, it’s not a difficulty. But otherwise, then you’re going to be speaking about others, it’s pajalpa. So if it’s not connected to the Lord, it’s going to get a problem.
How do you regulate your speech?
What you say, how you say it, when you say it. Like that. Because the urge to speak means when it comes into the mind, the ideas that it should immediately come out of the mouth. But you see, is this the appropriate time for that? You’re sitting in an informal situation with close friends, and you’re discussing some light topics and it’s jumping all over the place or whatever comes into the mind. It works then. Let’s say you’re in the temple, it’s a more formal situation, you desire to say something, and you’ll think, well, it’s practical. They’re here now, I’m here now, so I might not catch them till later, and this and that, so it’s a great time to say, but actually it’s not because the mood is something completely different. Or it may be the right time and the right thing to say, but how you say it. Is the mood right or is it consideration of the you or self and them and relationship, all those kind of things. That also, like you don’t talk too much in the Brahma Muhurta, even if it is important things. After the morning program, that’s when you talk all kinds of things. Your work, your service, your this and that. Japa time, you don’t talk about all those things. Does that make sense? So you do have regulation by time also. That’s what he said, the time, the place, the circumstance. It is the duty of a sober person to tolerate the urge of the mind.
Until one is habituated to control the urge of the mind, how can one perform devotional service with attention? As we said before, it’s that inattentiveness that you are not going to get so much benefit. One is not going to get to advanced stages if one is inattentive.
Because you are thinking of something else, whatever it may be.
A materialist sits in the chariot of the mind and never gets relief from its various urges, except during sleep.
Even during sleep, many thoughts such as good and bad dreams come. In order to regulate the urges of the mind, rishis have propounded astanga yoga and raja yoga. But the Lord’s prescription is that one should regulate the mind from the inferior taste by giving it a higher taste. Those who are on the path of devotional service can easily regulate the mind. In other words, what’s the taste in it? So that we can see here is that it’s important these elements of that the process itself, the culture itself is of value, because it’s a taste. Otherwise, then, where’s the taste going to go? If it’s just a regulation, it’s a rule, you have to follow it. Nice, it’s good, that’s pious, but the problem is where’s the taste come from? So if the higher taste doesn’t come, the tendency will be towards lower. Even if it’s not that one will perform an unapproved activity, but the point is that seeing the activity only as a regulation, that’s already dropped it from the devotional platform to the pious platform. That’s already a fallen condition.
Does that make sense? Though, ultimately, its intent is meant for Krishna, so one will get benefit there, but one will not get as much benefit as if it had been done with the proper, you know, how you said, with the proper understanding of the devotional attitude, the association, the taste that comes. You know what I’m saying? I tell you, take Prasad, because it’s a rule, no nonsense, and nobody talks anything, it’s very dry, very boring, like that. But the point is that you’re associating with devotees, so you take Prasad, conversation, but the conversation should be proper. You don’t talk management, you don’t talk politics, you don’t talk issues, you know, just pleasant, you know. If you can’t do that, then better than not saying anything.
I think in England they created those huge, big, hard candy balls for that purpose.
Huh? You know, the gobstoppers?
In Denmark they’re called shut-up drops. Shut-up drops. Okay. So you think somebody manufactured them to keep the kids quiet. Something like that, yeah. And, you know, and they seem to be getting bigger and bigger. They used to be quite small, but now they’re getting quite big. Yes, that means that they want them to be quiet for a longer period of time.
Shut-up drops.
Right, so it’s by the higher taste. That’s where it becomes dynamic. You know, so what, If devotional service is performed for the purpose of regulating the mind, then it is certainly not devoid of material desires.
Favorable cultivation of devotional service in relationship to Krishna is the real meaning of pure bhakti. Right? That’s what we just have mentioned. If devotional service is performed for the purpose of regulating the mind, right, I’m doing the devotional service so the mind will be regulated, then it is certainly not devoid of material desires.
Because why, you know, why would you want to regulate your mind? If that’s your purpose of performing the devotional activities to regulate the mind, what are you looking for? What’s your goal? Right? It would be peace. Right? So that means it’s material. It may be a refined material. That’s what I’m saying is sometimes we don’t make the distinction here. That’s why these fine, fine points are being made. They say, no, no, my mind’s so crazy, I have to regulate it. And all they’re talking about is a crazy mind. But they never talk about Krishna.
You know what I’m saying? In that connection, at another point, yes. But I’m saying in that. So the point is, why have a regulated mind? What’s the big deal? It’s only useful because you can think of Krishna. You can do service to Krishna. That’s his point. Does that make sense?
You know. It’s just like, yeah.
So someone who wants to regulate his mind, he’s making arrangements in order to regulate that mind. But it should be you’re trying to serve Krishna. You engage your mind in Krishna’s service, automatically it’s regulated. Because, in other words, the point is, it’s not that the activity changes. It’s just you focus on Krishna rather than focusing on the mind.
It won’t have the opposite effect in that it will be, if you regulate the mind, it will be uplifting. It will be progressive. But the point is, is that progression being engaged in Krishna’s service. Right? So just like you have sannyasa or renunciation.
Renunciation means it’s not for Krishna. Then you give the result and give it to Krishna. So that means in retroactive, that activity then was connected to Krishna. But until you renounce it and give it to Krishna, it’s not connected. Right? So it may be your purpose, but until it happens, it’s not done. Yeah. If I have money, that’s my money, I intend to give it to the temple. But I haven’t. Do I get any benefit for having given it to the temple? No. Right? But now, if I have done service for Krishna, right? And I’ve gone out, let’s say, distributed books for the temple and that money is for the temple. I haven’t turned it in at the temple yet, but I’ve already gotten the benefit for that money being Krishna’s because it’s not a matter of it’s mine until it gets to the temple. No, it’s his temple’s in any case.
Does that make sense? So that would be the difference, is that you’ve regulated the mind and so it’s a pious thing. Now, if you’ve connected that to Krishna, then in retroactive, you’ll get the benefit.
You know what I’m saying? And all that before, all that endeavor was connected to Krishna. But until you do that, it’s not. So that’s the difficulty. We may get so absorbed in regulating the mind, we forget to connect it to Krishna. And so until we do, and then we come across and then somebody says something of that, then we remember what it’s for, then we connect it. So it might be days or weeks or months of connection before it’s connected. But if the focus is on the devotional endeavor, then the effect is immediate.
Does that make sense? Because Krishna’s pleased. Therefore, then everything’s done. So that’s why he says the sages have mentioned in the Sangha Yoga and Raja Yoga, he says, but the Lord’s prescription is just the higher taste. Because the taste is in connection to Krishna. It’s devotional service. The taste is in connection to Krishna. So it’s already connected. He is a person. He is devotional service. You like devotional service. Therefore, it’s nice.
You know, I take prasad and don’t enjoy prasad and like that and it’s like that. If you think it’s nice, that’s sense gratification. But then that means the process of engaging the senses in the Lord’s service is not a viable option according to that definition. So you wouldn’t describe devotional service as engaging the senses in the Lord or the master of the senses. You would say devotional service is not engaging my senses at all. Yes. So therefore, that’s jnana. That’s jnana. So it’s not devotional service.
It may look like it. Oh, I’m controlling the senses. You know, because you’re supposed to control your senses in engaging in service, but its point is it’s the service. It’s only useful because the service can be rendered. If the service senses aren’t controlled, you can’t render service. Senses are controlled. When they’re controlled, you render service. When they’re not controlled, you can’t. That’s its only use.
You know what I’m saying? It means you have the knife, you can cut up the potato. You don’t have the knife, you can’t cut the potato. But the point is it’s not cutting. It’s the potatoes in small cubes. That’s the point. Knives do that.
You know what I’m saying? So we get distracted that the form of it becomes more important than the actual purpose. So that’s what these points are bringing that element out. Favorable cultivation or devotional service in relationship to Krsna. Right? So that’s the point. You’re looking at it in relationship to Krsna. So now if you’re thinking I have to control my senses so that I can be absorbed in Krsna, that’s favorable. But if he’s just thinking no, I have to control the senses because that’s pious. Then we get into this whole thing. Then the person who’s not controlling, the person who’s doing that, then they’re not advanced, they’re a disturbance to the whole thing. And then they have to say something and then announce those that they made and the president will say this and that. And it appears that it’s all devotional service but it’s annoying because it’s not.
Does that make sense?
Therefore, whatever pure devotional service is performed, joyfulness of the mind automatically arises from amongst extraneous fruits.
So if it’s performed properly, that’s why Krsna said it’s joyfully performed. Right? But it’s joyful because you’re not trying to find happiness in something material. Right? You can’t be joyful in devotional service if you’re trying to find your joy somewhere else.
Yes. The mind is dealing with the emotion. The mind is emotions.
So that’s why it’s important to center on Krsna. Yes. Because the mind… See, the mind… Why so much focus is on the mind? Right? It means we’re being specific. We’ll talk about the intelligence or the senses but the general discussions you’ll find are always about the mind because the mind controls the senses and the mind is what is interacting with the intelligence. In other words, what the intelligence contemplates is what the mind wants it to. Right? So therefore, if you have the mind, you already have the intelligence and that. Does that make sense? Yeah, it means if you have the mind, the body is already there. You have the mind, you already have the senses. So therefore, then body, mind and words. But the mind is the central. But to be… You know, to get at the mind then we break it down. So then intellectually you look at it, how that works, the senses, how that works. And so it gives… The mind then has to contemplate more. It’s not just what I feel like but there’s reasons for it. There’s authority. And by following… If the mind’s accepted and has no doubts about authority then it will try to apply what is heard from authority. But if there’s doubt about authority then, you know, it could be this, it could be what I feel like. You know what I’m saying? In other words, you can look at it directly as that. If you look at a time in the yatra when there’s no doubt of authority, then the engagement is full. But when there’s doubt in authority then there’s all kinds of ideas that it could be they, it could be not be they, it could be according to Prabhupada, it could be not. But when everyone accepts authority, there’s no question. What Prabhupada said, that’s what we do.
It’s direct. You can see it. It’s not that you have… There’s a disparity there. It’s always like that. So in other words, you see the zone is dynamic as long as there’s no doubts. As soon as there’s doubts, then it’s like that. So the intellectuals think that they’re doing a great service by throwing out these points of contemplation because they’re important. No. Mental speculation is important to them. Work is important to everybody else. Right? So then they throw that out and then because of that no one can function. And the reason they throw it out is they’re not functioning in the first place.
But they think they’re functioning because mental speculation, they’ll consider work. So they feel they’re fully engaged but they’re not.
Does that make sense? So if you look, it’s a science. It’s not… Mental speculation is controlled by the mind? Mental speculation… It means the mind is giving the intelligence things to do. Then it’s called mental speculation. See, if what the intelligence is contemplating is what’s recommended by Shastra, then it’s called contemplation. Right? Manana. Like that. You’ve heard the Shastra, you contemplate it, you make it work in your situation. Mental speculation is where it’s based on, you know, karma, jnana. And so you are contemplating the situation to get your fruitive or, or, you know, how do you say, intellectual result. So you try different ways and the speculation is you try this, then you try this, then you try this, then you try this. So therefore it’s called speculation. But if you’re doing the same mechanical process based on authority, right, for the purpose of devotional development, it’s not, even though it’s the same process, it’s not called mental speculation. It’s called contemplation.
Right? Or vichara. Right? Looking at something from different angles. Like that. Just like the senses, when they’re engaged for fruitive purposes, you call it sense gratification. But if the senses are engaged for devotional service, you just call it devotional service.
Good results, and then you can convince the mind by those. Yeah. Like that. If one is, I mean, generally result-oriented, then that would be, how one would convince, you know, if it’s a matter of just you like to do something, then do something for Krishna, and then it’s nice, so you like that. You know, if it’s an identity element or it’s just the analytical, whichever of these four are your inspiration for doing or not doing, then those are your areas to connect to Krishna.
Right? It means if they’re strongly connected to Krishna, it becomes real. If it’s not strongly connected to Krishna, then it becomes, you know, strong, it becomes fixed. Then, you know, it works nice.
Srimad Bhagavatam 7.132 states, tasmat kenapya-payena mana krsne nivetayate.
Somehow or another, one must consider the form of Krsna very seriously. If one follows this instruction, then the mind will be engaged at the lotus feet of Krsna, and it will not easily wander onto other subjects, for the practition of the urge of the mind is regulated by pure cultivation of favorable devotional service in relationship to Krsna. So one must consider the form. So whatever it is, when somehow or another connects it, you know, find some way, either direct, indirect, some way, then it becomes good. So the regulation is by cultivation of favorable devotional service.
Right? It says here in relation to Krsna. So devotional service may be favorable, but you don’t remember Krsna. It’s being done for Krsna. So you will get that benefit, but when it’s done, when you’re doing it for Krsna and in relationship to Krsna, then you get even more.
To restrain the urge of anger is compulsory for those who are thirsty for devotional service. Anger arises when a man’s lust is unfulfilled. When one is angry, the result gradually leads one to ruination.
It is said in Sri Caitanya-caritamrta, Madhya -lila, 19, 149, Because a devotee of Lord Krsna is desireless, he is peaceful. So desires here means no desire for material. It doesn’t mean you don’t desire to please Krsna.
No insignificant lust can remain in the heart of one who relishes pure devotional service. Therefore, there is no possibility of anger arising in his mind. Those whose devotional service is motivated cannot conquer anger. It is not possible to conquer anger by intelligence alone. In a very short time, attachments for sense enjoyment overcomes the function of the intelligence and gives anger a place in its kingdom.
Because the thing is, anger means intelligence, you’re looking at the field. But because anger is connected with attachment, right? Right? It means, in other words, the love for Krsna is being misapplied.
Right? So that attachment, that unfulfilled, gives rise to anger. Right? So the point is, when do you do an activity?
It means, yes. But while you’re contemplating the object?
Yeah, when you’ve seen the result. So when you’re looking at the result, is it analytical? No. It means you’ve crossed intelligence.
That’s why it’s so easy to engage in something without the intelligence being used. So that’s his point here. Intelligence you can’t conquer by intelligence. Right? You use the intelligence, but it’s not by intelligence alone.
Right? Does that make sense? Because the point is, any activity means the intelligence is functioning in connection with the field, but your reason for doing it is not based intellectually. You’re doing it because you want to do it.
I like it. I like it, yeah. So the mind is always active. Yes.
That’s the problem materially, and that is the advantage spiritually.
Like the cowherd boys, they go to sleep at night thinking that they’ll meet Krsna in the morning, so then they’re very happy thinking about all these things.
Yeah, it means intelligence.
Because intelligence oversees the field. Like that. It means it analyzes the field and all that. But it means anger comes after frustration. Right? So we said that when you get a result, then that result moves back to sambandha.
Right? So now here it’s the same principle, but you didn’t get the result so that, in other words, that happiness or whatever you gained moves back to there. So that lack of gaining, and that moves back to there. Because anger is a manifestation of ignorance, so that’s the field.
So it comes back to there. Then based on anger, then you act again, and then you get the result, and then it keeps going.
Right? So in other words, anger can only be conquered when there is no motivation, no material motivation. Right? Because the point is, desire for anything, if you’ve not gotten, then it will create anger. Right? So in other words, we can use the term lust to mean everything that’s material. Right? Desire for anything other than Krishna is lust. Because desire for Krishna is love. Right? But if we’re being specific, then we say lust manifests between man and woman, then that will be called by the term lust. Lust in connection with money, we’ll call that greed. Lust in social, then prestige. Does that make sense? So it’ll be all those different. As I said, lust is just the transformation of the natural love. Right? Just like the consciousness has become covered, so that love has become covered. So therefore you can say lust. So anything you want, like you want the place to be clean, it’s a good thing. Right? Somebody’s made a mess, you become angry because you’re attached to the cleanliness. But the point is that the cleanliness is for Krishna, then there’s no need to become angry because now, you know, keeping it clean for Krishna is service, so now there’s more service. Right? Does that make sense? So there’s not going to arise from there. One will show some displeasure to the person who’s making the mess if it’s unnecessary because it’s not service. So it’s not to their devotional benefit to be involved in that kind of activity.
Does that make sense? But one will be able to present it nicely because one has no attachment for that.
Does that make sense? What if it’s their service to clean it up? What if it’s their service to clean it up? It means the person who’s making the mess, so first they make the mess, then clean it up so they can do more service?
Well, it’s Krishna’s, so therefore you would tend to not make a mess unless it’s like the mess means, you know, going to the kitchen and cooking, it makes a mess, and so then you clean it up. We’re talking about, you know, spilling, spilling, you’re taking out the garbage and you spill it on the, you know, on the living room carpet. That’s unnecessary.
No, but it’s just because they’re doing something that’s against devotional service, so therefore you’re correcting that.
You know what I’m saying? Because the point is, all these qualities, they have their connection with Krishna or not. You know what I’m saying? So there it’s induced because the service is not being rendered properly, and so it has this natural manifestation, right? In other words, you know, Hanuman is, you know, not very pleased with how Ravana is dealing with Ram’s consort, right? And so, you know, therefore then he is dealing, you know, also in a way that would, why would he do this?
Why would somebody run off with someone else’s wife and think they can get away with it? Lust? Okay, I mean, that would there, but you would have, means, you would have to have a little bit more backup.
Right? Means lust is there, but then, you know, one of those moments when lust is not there.
Right? So you have to have confidence. Right? So how does one get confidence on the material platform? Confident person has what? Yeah, power, wealth, position, something, right? So, Hanuman, in expressing his displeasure, what did he do?
Yeah, he ruined the Ashokavan and then burnt down the kingdom. So now you can’t be as confident.
You know? Like that.
Does that make sense? So, so in other words, it’s applied very specifically. So it’s not because you upset me, therefore I’m going to make you suffer. That’s what on the material platform anger does. Right? But this is a matter of correction. So, so that’s the difference, is that, yeah.
By unflinching devotion to Krishna, everything is achieved. Right? So in other words, if the devotion is constant on Krishna, then, then the, the, there won’t be, how you say, unfulfilled lust, therefore there won’t be anger. One who, one who can control the urges of speech, mind and anger by devotional service is called Dheera. Right? So these three go together. Right? The speech, the mind and the anger. Depending on what you speak, then that agitates the mind and that creates anger. Because you said before, by speaking, then you talk about others, then someone’s going to get annoyed. And so when they get annoyed, what are they going to do? They’re going to make your life miserable. So what does that make you? It disturbs the mind and you become angry. So they go together.
And it’s everyone’s duty to subdue the urge of the tongue. The more the tongue eats, the more its hankering increases.
For those who wander for the pleasure of the tongue, attaining Krsna is very difficult. One should fill his belly with whatever is easily available. By offering Krsna foods in the mode of goodness and honoring them as prasada, the tongue is satisfied and service to Krsna is cultivated. If palatable prasada is easily available, then the tongue’s greed will gradually be controlled, rather than increased. So it’s what’s easily available. In other words, you don’t make an over -endeavor to arrange.
Does that make sense? It doesn’t mean that you’re cooking for the deities or the devotees. You don’t take lots of endeavor to do that. But it’s what is appropriate for the situation. But this is just, one is looking for nice things to eat, therefore one is going here and there, trying to find them. Because they’re, how do you say, more rare. So it’s like, this one thing is here and that one thing is there. Those who are really into eating, you go to one place for one thing. They have a whole menu. Everybody else, they only want that one thing because that one thing is it and then this other place for that. So that’s a lot of… Here is what comes easily. Foods in the mode of goodness. Generally, foods in the mode of goodness are easy. Right? Foods in the mode of passion, those are more difficult. Right? Does that make sense?
So, so, but it says the palate of the Prasad is easily available. Then, then you engage the tongue like that. But it’s easily available so there’s no over -endeavor.
So, because…
The urge of the belly is a disturbance. The requirement of the stomach is to eat for the maintenance of the life and mitigation of hunger. Those who are thirsty for devotional service should maintain their life by moderate eating. Those who endeavor to over-eat are called gluttons. One of the qualities of devotees is mitabhuk, eating what is necessary. So what is necessary is different from person to person and the situation. So it doesn’t mean one person eats a lot and someone else eats a little so the person eats a lot, therefore he has a problem. No. If he uses that, that physically is engaged so he can use that, then it’s not over-eating.
So necessary means… When they say necessary, it means what’s required so that you can function in your service. Right? You sit all day, you need to eat less. You’re physically active all day, you eat more.
So I think you just worked out your service.
Yeah, yeah. Just thinking, he says, OK, so I gotta find some more active stuff.
By eating less, the body remains healthy and does not disturb one’s devotional service. So eating less means less than over-eating. It doesn’t mean less than what is necessary. Because if you eat less and then you can’t physically function, then that’s also not very useful.
Those who have no strength to tolerate the urge of the stomach are always greedy to eat. Those who are firmly convinced that nothing can be eaten unless, besides Krishna Prasad, are especially able to tolerate the urge of the belly. Because unless it’s offered to Krishna, then restrictions like fasting on prescribed days are also models of instruction for controlling the urge of the stomach. Because then, even though we have difficulty, on a fast day, somehow or another, no one died. If you look at it, there’s one thing you can say on a fast day, no one ever died. So that means it didn’t end up in a hospital, it wasn’t permanently inconvenienced, anything like that. So one starts to learn that I can control the eating and still live.
So that’s one of the advantages there, is you learn to. Because the other is that you have more time to worry about Krishna and be engaged in the service. That’s the main point. But as a side point, one learns that somehow or another one won’t die.
The urge of the genital is formidable for persons who are averse to the Lord. In the Srimad-Bhagavatam 11.5.11 it is said, In this material world, the conditioned soul is always inclined to sex, meat-eating and intoxication. Therefore, religious scriptures never actually encourage such activities. So this is the 11th canto. So, here it’s saying, the religious scriptures never actually. They may give regulation for these things, but they never actually encourage.
Because otherwise these are, as Krishna says, these are the natural inclinations of the materialistic living entity. So we’ll say, Oh no, it’s Kali-yuga and all these things are there. No, it’s always. Every age is there. The difference is in the other ages they control it. In Kali-yuga, they don’t. So it’s not that it’s a different thing. You know what I’m saying?
So, scriptures never actually encourage such activities. They’ll give definition, but you’ll always find within them they’re explaining that basically it’s all not very important.
The purport of this statement from the Srimad -Bhagavatam is confidential. Those who possess a material body made of flesh and blood are always inclined to associate with women. To minimize this inclination, the marriage ceremony is recommended. Those who wish to get free from the codes of marriage are almost like animals.
Almost, because animals have four legs while they only have two, so they’re not quite up to the standards. So they never quite get to that full animalistic meaning, get up to, not down to.
But those who have crossed beyond the rules of this natural inclination by the association of devotees and the strength of their service and have thus attained attraction for spiritual subject matters, for them associating with the opposite sex is very insignificant. In other words, it’s not that time’s not spent. It’s not that it itself has that value.
It’s the value you put on something. It’s not whether it’s performed or not. Just like the devotee. How many hours are you chanting? And how many hours is one at work? Two hours is japa, but eight hours is work. But for the devotee in his mind, which is significant? The japa, not the work. So it’s not by volume.
Insignificance can mean if there’s no need, then there is no association.
Need meaning there’s no service or some social obligation or some other recommended activity.
So, but it can mean that, but it also means that even though one is associating all day, it’s insignificant compared to the devotional.
That doesn’t mean etiquette’s followed any less. It just means that all that is not a major thing. Does that make sense?
Persons who are filled with attachment for material enjoyment can never tolerate the urge of the genital.
Many of them engage in illicit activities. Regarding this propensity, those who thirst for devotional service are divided into two groups.
Those whose attraction has been purified by the strength of sadhu-saṅga give up the association of women altogether and continually engage in devotional service. Persons in this group are known as renounced Vaiṣṇavas.
Those whose propensity for associating with women has not been destroyed accept the codes of marriage and remain as householders while engaging in devotional service. Associating with women as prescribed in the scriptures means to control the urge of the genitals.
In other words, it becomes regulated into its place. So it’s not that there is it becomes the prominence.
Right? You know, it’s like you have materialistic young men talking about being with women or getting married. The whole thing’s about sex. Right? So the difficulty is is is Yeah. So here is that the devotees have given up this this idea for enjoyment but then there’ll be those who it’s totally given up and those who it’s regulated. Right? And then it functions. But it’s not the primary element. A householder sex is not the primary aspect. Right? You know, karmis then much of the time they’ll judge you know, someone goes, oh, you know, how’s the marriage? You know, somebody’s upset and that and so then like that. Oh, what happened to somebody in the marriage? Oh, you know, yeah, you know, it seems so bad and all this and that. Oh, why was the last time you had sex? You know, and they say, oh, two weeks ago. Oh, so then it’s fine.
You understand? Or, when’s the last time? No, we haven’t had sex for eight years. Oh, you got a problem.
You understand? So, this is because that is the basis of it. But a grihasta, that’s not the basis. Like that. It’s that cooperation to serve Krishna. Right? But it’s done in that environment. So there’s the male-female interaction and all those things that one has that attraction for. But it’s done in an environment of service to the Lord. Does that make sense? So it’s a difference.
When one properly tolerates the above-mentioned six urges, that is favorable for his devotional service. And when those urges are strong, that is unfavorable for one’s devotional service. To subdue these six urges is called dharya. As long as one has a material body, these propensities cannot be totally uprooted. But by properly engaging them in the appropriate subjects, they no longer remain faulty. An intelligent person should direct these urges away from their respective subjects and make them favorable to devotional service.
That can only be done with patience.
So here, patient, because they’ll go, then you have to bring them back. Then they go away and then they bring them back. And so it takes patience to do that. So just as those first three go together, the last three. There’s overeating, then the stomach gets deterred, then the genitals. So they go together. Just like if one speaks, then the mind becomes agitated in anger. So that’s what Prabhupada says. Controlling the tongue is the essential point because that’s where both start. Both lines start. So one is by speaking, so you chant and discuss about Krsna. And the other is then it eats, so then you eat Krsna Prasad. So if those two are in place, then the other four will become easy.
There’s another meaning applicable to the word dharya. Those who engage in sadhana desire to attain the results. Karmis hope to obtain heavenly happiness by fruitive activities. Dhyanis hope to obtain liberation by speculative knowledge. And devotees hope to please Krsna by their devotion.
Did you catch a subtlety there?
The opening of the sentence and the end of the sentence.
Those who engage in sadhana and devotees hope to please Krsna by their devotion.
So sadhana doesn’t automatically mean devotion.
You may be doing it to please Krsna, therefore it becomes connected to devotion and that makes it glorious. But it’s the devotion that’s expressed through sadhana. So one can do the sadhana because then, you know, I get up early because then the mind will be peaceful and then I get my rounds chanted and then, you know, I’ll have the day free to do so many other activities but I haven’t really connected it at this point. You understand? But again, it goes back and forth, right? Yes, yes, of course. So it increases and then… Yes, of course. …devotion and then again… They nourish each other. But the point is being made that just because the sadhana is going on nicely doesn’t mean the devotion is. No, no. Because the point is that you do have those who by nature they’re controlled by the mode of goodness. So they can do sadhana in a very fixed way. But it doesn’t necessarily mean that it’s devotional. But because they’re in the association of devotees that association they’ll be reminded of that. They will connect it. So at least they have something to connect. You know, like that. You know what I’m saying? But the point is being made is if we’re talking about pure devotional service then we have to be able to ascertain what’s not.
But otherwise, like super fixed sadhana would tend to crack or fall down if the devotion is not there. Yeah, if the devotion is not there. But if the devotion is there then that person will be very dynamic. Very powerful. You know, very exemplary. Others will be able to be inspired. So they’ll be able to function as a leader. Like that. So it’s good. But what we’re saying is good sadhana without the proper devotional mood or sufficient is not that ideal. Right? The idea of sadhana is there to support so that one is always engaged in devotional service. That’s… But if the devotion is there then the sadhana will come. Yes, then the sadhana will come. Yeah, and even if someone doesn’t have, he’s weak at sadhana, if the devotion is there and that patience is there then with time it will come anyway. That’s why ultimately it doesn’t matter what position you start from. Everyone will get to the same platform of being fully absorbed in Krishna. Now what fields they’re using to do that, that will remain different.
But the Krishna conscious position, that will be exactly the same.
No, engaged in sadhana, the desire to attain the results. No, whatever that is. Because people do a sadhana for something. Gyan, but also devotees are doing. You know? But that’s what I’m saying. Devotee might do… It’s to get the result that’s why you’re looking at it. Right? He’s very focused, you know, like that, no nonsense. Janmasi is going to chant 64 rounds. He’s very focused. He wants to get that result. But the point is, is that result for Krishna. That makes it devotional. Or if it’s not, then it’s pious.
Does that make sense? The point is this sadhana. He says here, it says, karbis, hope to attain heavenly food. So it’s bringing out sadhana because it just means following a practice of regulation in one’s life. But one’s doing it for a purpose. Right? One gets up in the brahma muhurta because it’s the best time to contemplate. There’s a result you want. Now is that result connected to Krishna or not?
Yeah, otherwise then you get up early because it does that. You know, it’s the best time, mangala artha, you could japa and all this. But then you had to do some e -mails and then you found, wow, that was a really great time. I got so much more done and all that. And then after a while, then you get up early because you can get more e -mail done.
Right?
It’s really not so much we’re talking non -devotional. We’re talking about one’s become distracted. So one’s not getting that full devotional benefit. Because any devotee performing the sadhana, generally speaking, even if he’s not remembering Krishna and he’s distracted, ultimately it’s meant for Krishna. So at some point he’ll think of Krishna, connect it to Krishna and he’ll get the benefit. What we’re saying is because you’re getting the benefit afterwards, you’re not getting the benefit during. If you’re getting the benefit during, it develops more. You know what I’m saying? It’s like, I’m doing now, I’m getting the benefit now. I’m still doing now. I’m getting the benefit for the now now. The other one, I’m only getting the benefit in retrospect.
Does that make sense?
So in other words, however one’s performing devotional service, one is getting benefit.
Does that make sense? But what Bhaktivinoda Thakura is pointing out is what benefit you could be getting, you’re not getting. In other words, we’re doing our devotional service and we’re happy. It’s nice. It’s okay. Like that. But when they talk about devotional service being an unlimited, shoreless ocean of ecstasy, that we’re not tasting. Why not? Because it’s not pure.
Yeah. But even living in the present is only important if in the present you’re remembering Krishna. Otherwise, for the materialist, if he lives in the present, his material life will go better. The only advantage of living in the present is then you can be Krishna conscious.
Does that make sense?
Okay. I guess we’ll… Yeah, because we won’t be able to discuss it. We’ll end soon. Om Hare Krishna Hare Krishna Krishna Krishna Hare Hare Hare Rama Hare Rama Rama Rama Hare Hare Jaya. Srila Prabhupada ki. Samaveda bhakti-vrindiki. Janatai Govardhanam.
